A fatwa from islamQA

Novice

Brother imran

Salaam. Nothing personal as I am just a student and trying to learn Quran in its language. I do not use translations and alhamdolillah can understand Quranic Arabic in a very modest way. I am not a scholar but have spent almost 10 years to learn it as a humble student.

first of all i did not electrify you, i electrify the difference , for rectify the errors,, remember advancne accounting when teacher rectify the errors in balance sheet just kidding ...chill out no need to be personal... its better to share views with each other thats y we are here.. beleving or rejecting something is totally a responsibilty of your own.. btw its not what i asked i mean what i electrify you still did not tell me red and green difference..lol ok forget about it..

Brother think about this 7621 Here Khudrun means green

699 Here Khadiran means greenery/plants.

This is how root words give derived meanings in Arabic language.

first i was thinking not to reply you regarding this but as a brother i always like to share my understanding with people if they get advantage from it.. so i have an advise for you .. if you read traditional translation your mind will probably think and understand what an interpretor want you to understand... so this book quran we should read it with care.. now think about this translation..

5720 Know that the worldly life is no more than play and distraction and adornments, and boasting among you, and to increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to the rejecters. But then they dry-up and turn yellow, and become useless hay. And in the Hereafter there is severe retribution, and forgiveness from God and acceptance. This worldly life is no more than a deceiving enjoyment.

Please see red part. Example is not of plants but rain which brings growth of plants.

The ayat is
= like an example of
= rain
= pleased
= ?
= its growth.

Could you please explain me for my benefit that why a rejecter will be pleased with rain because it gives growth to plants and how it fits with the rest of the ayat? Nothing personal here I just want to learn.

and one more thing even if you put the farmers inside it for making u understand so its mean the farmer who are kaffir by faith not by proffession....

and one more thing as a bonus... this triliteral root kf f r ( &#1585 occurs 525 times in the Quran and everywhere
all the traditional translators used word kaffir as rejector apart from this this occassion.. = weak translation becoz human being = limited knowledge..& sometimes do errors..

Like I already said in my other reply that root KAFARA means "to hide" In the matter of belief a Kafir is the one who hides the truth.

May God bless you.

The_Sardar

In the matter of belief a Kafir is the one who hides the truth.

And dont forget anyone can be a kaffir, nobody is immune and they are dangerous people.

Peace be upon you and God bless everyone.

imrankhawaja

Brother imran

Salaam. Nothing personal as I am just a student and trying to learn Quran in its language. I do not use translations and alhamdolillah can understand Quranic Arabic in a very modest way. I am not a scholar but have spent almost 10 years to learn it as a humble student.

w salam

i hope in these ten years you learn a lot and you will learn through out your whole life and stilll you will feel there are lot of things to know... spend as much time as u can ... practise makes a man perfect a famous proverb..

Could you please explain me for my benefit that why a rejecter will be pleased with rain

i did not see any rejector that not pleased with rain, usually everybody like rain, but when rain make them wet they start cursing rain in case of uk people lol

beleivers also say bad things to rain when it makes them wet lol

apart from that not only kaffirs but believers also get please from things which is for pleasing , like nice taste of food , beautiful valleys, sunset in sea... all things make rejector please.. does it make make sense now... or a beleiver should not be pleased from these ?

Like I already said in my other reply that root KAFARA means "to hide" In the matter of belief a Kafir is the one who hides the truth.

kafir= rejector , according to he dictionary of quran if you talk with respect to quran and everywhere everybody translate it as rejector.. about 57 .20 traditional muslims translations are not much worthy they copy cat some early scholars the same way how they interpret things and its possible to do err on one two occassions... but look at arabic root kafir is quite clear.. watch a link

quranic kafir

the one who hide truth = liar ..

peace ..

The_Celt

I believe that the Quran is as clear as day regarding there being absolutely no compulsion in religion. And I find it sickening that so many "Muslims" such as ISIS want Hindus, Buddhists, even People of the Book and "non-orthodox" Muslims to convert to their twisted ultra-Wahhabi ideology or die. Let them worship God how they want to- that's what He says.

To put the Quran's opinion on people of non-Muslim/Kitaabi faiths simply- Live and let live!

imrankhawaja

after that if you want to understand the subject of the verse ... 57.20

its actually regarding a worldy life and God give an example in the the shape of plants , God can choose any example even an example of mosquito... but the subject is clearl read it you will understand i try to explain you in easy mode may b it will help..

infact God is advising us.. this life is temporary we should not be behave like we will stay here forever and will not held accountable for our deeds.. and its an illusion actually . then God explain with an example that when rain drops rejector get please despite knowing it will not last forever when the plants get died turn yellow etc... so rain develop a life in plants but not a permanent life its temporary like our life and kaffir still did not get a lesson and continue rejecting God... so pleasing for a specific time got a reality which mean nothing will stay permanent ,, look again with this view now..

5720 Know that the worldly life is no more than play and distraction and adornments, and boasting among you, and to increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to the rejecters. But then they dry-up and turn yellow, and become useless hay. And in the Hereafter there is severe retribution, and forgiveness from God and acceptance. This worldly life is no more than a deceiving enjoyment.

Novice

kafir= rejector , according to he dictionary of quran if you talk with respect to quran and everywhere everybody translate it as rejector.. about 57 .20 traditional muslims translations are not much worthy they copy cat some early scholars the same way how they interpret things and its possible to do err on one two occassions... but look at arabic root kafir is quite clear.. watch a link
quranic kafir

the one who hide truth = liar ..

Salaam imran

Thank you for the link but it appears that you did not study it yourself. The link provided translates "alkuffar" as tiller. http//corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(572017)
Please look at it again.

For me purpose of discussion is not that who is correct but to learn. If you think your understanding is correct then stick to it.

There are people who spent time with the desert people in Arabia and learned roots from them. When I started learning Arabic and its roots I was amazed how translations have twisted the beautiful message of Quran. Let me show you an example. Root Sa-Ba-Ra conveys meanings of persistence and hard work but in translations mostly it means to be patient and bear injustice and reward will be in the next life. As a result the nation who used to be hard working and persistent in their efforts has changed into the one waiting for reward in next life.

The root Ka-Fa-Ra means to cover/hide. That is what this root means but of course I respect your understanding.

Thanks for your time and God bless you.

imrankhawaja

Thank you for the link but it appears that you did not study it yourself.

did you really know what is the purpose of sending you that link... ?

to make u check the root word on 525 occassions according to qurnic dictionary.. apart from this 57.20 traditional use it as disbeleiver/rejector.. the tiller /farmer or hider is not there in quran. this word is absent apart from some traditional interpretation.. still not got it then its ok if you want to believe on 2+2=5 its ur choice ..

God bless you too

Novice

did you really know what is the purpose of sending you that link... ?

to make u check the root word on 525 occassions according to qurnic dictionary.. apart from this 57.20 traditional use it as disbeleiver/rejector..

No offense brother but why they chose farmer/tiller at one place out of 525. Reflect on the 5720 and may be God show you the light.

the tiller /farmer or hider is not there in quran. this word is absent apart from some traditional interpretation..

Are you 100 percent sure about your claim brother? Please consult Project Root List and see the meaning of root Ka-Fa-Ra Some brothers have put lots of effort in making this list. May Allah reward them for their effort.
Here is the link for ready reference for you. http//www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htm

Also check Lughat ul Quran for meanings of the root at http//qes.no/Lughat/LughatVolum-III.pdf

still not got it then its ok if you want to believe on 2+2=5 its ur choice ..

I already said brother my purpose is not to win a discussion but to learn. I do not find any reason to change my understanding of root KA-Fa-Ra used at 5720 at the moment.

God bless you.

parvez_mushtaq

And what is the context of 905 in your opinion?

If you follow this thread carefully the context was explained beautifully by GL .i will reproduce his answer for you

Peace parvez.

Taking verses out of context has always been a problem to the "idol worshippers"! Both at the time of the prophet and now.

The first verse gives you and those who deserted Qoran your answers ,but you still insist on your/their ways!!!!

Proclaim to those you signed the treaty with!!!
This first verse explains who GOD is talking about.
These "Mushrikeen" have violated the treaty that has been agreed with the prophet. !!!
Look how GOD is just with those who do not break the treaty, even though they are still" Mushrikeen"
96
If one of the idol worshipers sought safe passage with you, you shall grant him safe passage, so that he can hear the word of God, then send him back to his place of security. That is because they are people who do not know.

97
How can the idol worshipers demand any pledge from God and from His messenger? Exempted are those who have signed a peace treaty with you at the Sacred Masjid. If they honor and uphold such a treaty, you shall uphold it as well. God loves the righteous.

Brother study Qoran and stop supporting /pushing secondary source views/ideas . GOD is forgiving Most Merciul.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

I don't think i can explain better than this
In short ,the context was about the war and treaty with the mushrik of Mecca

....................
So you admit that salafis are of different religion? I hope what you wrote above should make you understand why we don't want to discuss Islam with you.

No they are not , real
i find no difference between you and salafi
you are fanatic about your faith as they are .you cannot tolerate salafi and it is vice versa .i have discussed Islam with lot of people here and at times i find lot of them could not answer me
if you think my perception about abrogation is wrong then you should have an answer to say i am wrong .i never got a single perfect argument from you .even as today ,either you divert from the topic or you start giving sermons .pl read the above answer of GL regarding the context of the verse 9.05
did you noticed he had unknowingly confirmed the abrogation .I will make it more clear for you .as per him the context is war and treaty of musrikh of mecca and the verse 9.05 commands to kill them at them same time the verse 60.08
which says
Verse 60.08
Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous toward them and acting justly toward them. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.

there are two substations here
1.during war ALLAH subahnavatal ordered to kill the non Muslims till the repent
2.if the situation is not war then we have to just with them

if the first verse to be revealed was 9.05 then the verse 60.08 is the abrogation to meet the demands of the situation .if 60.08 was the first verse to be revealed than 9.05 is the abrogation for the situation demands .in both cases abrogation is inevitable

Do you have any answer for this ,Reel .pl don't divert from the topic .at least this time i am expecting a very good argument from you

For your information, abrogation in terminological sense is the concept of shias and salafi will never acknowledge it .they would rather start killing people instead of accepting the shia's ideology

imrankhawaja

No offense brother but why they chose farmer/tiller at one place out of 525. Reflect on the 5720 and may be God show you the light.

Are you 100 percent sure about your claim brother? Please consult Project Root List and see the meaning of root Ka-Fa-Ra Some brothers have put lots of effort in making this list. May Allah reward them for their effort.

I already said brother my purpose is not to win a discussion but to learn. I do not find any reason to change my understanding of root KA-Fa-Ra used at 5720 at the moment.

God bless you.

RED becoz weak interpretation and human mistake is something very normal.. if one person do error and rest of the other repeat the same error its does not make it correct.. yeh one more thing God obviously show us light not to rely on traditional translation lol

BLUE i m sure becoz the clear arabic word kaffir/rejector is there. tilller/farmer is absent in there 57.20 so it enough for me to claim something which is very clear like crystal..

GREEN but its look like you did not learn anything .. best of luck with your root , when you have winning and losing in the head always then its a real problem to accept the apparent claim.. even it come from quranic dictionary..

God bless you

get some time and put this word farmer on all other occassion (525) of quran instead of rejector then let me know what you understand. and does it really make sense..

reel

If you follow this thread carefully the context was explained beautifully by GL .i will reproduce his answer for you I don't think i can explain better than this
In short ,the context was about the war and treaty with the mushrik of Mecca
No they are not , real
i find no difference between you and salafi
you are fanatic about your faith as they are .you cannot tolerate salafi and it is vice versa .i have discussed Islam with lot of people here and at times i find lot of them could not answer me
if you think my perception about abrogation is wrong then you should have an answer to say i am wrong .i never got a single perfect argument from you .even as today ,either you divert from the topic or you start giving sermons .pl read the above answer of GL regarding the context of the verse 9.05
did you noticed he had unknowingly confirmed the abrogation .I will make it more clear for you .as per him the context is war and treaty of musrikh of mecca and the verse 9.05 commands to kill them at them same time the verse 60.08
which says
Verse 60.08
Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous toward them and acting justly toward them. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.

there are two substations here
1.during war ALLAH subahnavatal ordered to kill the non Muslims till the repent
2.if the situation is not war then we have to just with them

if the first verse to be revealed was 9.05 then the verse 60.08 is the abrogation to meet the demands of the situation .if 60.08 was the first verse to be revealed than 9.05 is the abrogation for the situation demands .in both cases abrogation is inevitable

Do you have any answer for this ,Reel .pl don't divert from the topic .at least this time i am expecting a very good argument from you

For your information, abrogation in terminological sense is the concept of shias and salafi will never acknowledge it .they would rather start killing people instead of accepting the shia's ideology

I am in tears that you have called me fanatic about this Islam of brain and heart use. I am speechless that I am able to demonstrate that I stand against the evil of blind faith and terrorism of fake scholars.

yay

Phiss, we take the entire Quran into consideration when it comes to knowing when war is correct...not a few verses. So you aren't gonna like if I say that a group can fight only with the ones who wronged them.

if the situation is not war then we have to just with them

How cutely you skip verses and brain use to form your conclusion and how such conclusion leads to killing of pregnant nonMuslims. Sad! If you truly wanna know Quran like we do you basically have to undo all your sectarian beliefs. We can't help you really. Allah guides people. Not us. And I am not sure if you ever will understand a thing since you seem to have a habit of changing sides too many times and turning verses up side down for defense. It is more interesting and worthwhile to discuss with those who know what they believe in. So Ill live you in your world of mutability. See ya!

Novice

RED becoz weak interpretation and human mistake is something very normal..

Does it apply to you as well or you are imune to mistakes?

BLUE i m sure becoz the clear arabic word kaffir/rejector is there. tilller/farmer is absent in there 57.20 so it enough for me to claim something which is very clear like crystal..

Yes al-kuffar is there but rejector is your insertion. I already said you can have any understanding but it is not binding for others to accept it

GREEN but its look like you did not learn anything .. best of luck with your root , when you have winning and losing in the head always then its a real problem to accept the apparent claim.. even it come from quranic dictionary..

Thanks for your judgement. I do not know which Quranic dictionary you are referring.

get some time and put this word farmer on all other occassion (525) of quran instead of rejector then let me know what you understand. and does it really make sense..

I do not think Arabic works like that. We have to understand Quranic terms with context, root meanings and idiomatic expressions/phrases.

God bless you

good_logic

Peace parvez.

You say,quote

pl read the above answer of GL regarding the context of the verse 9.05
did you noticed he had unknowingly confirmed the abrogation .I will make it more clear for you .as per him the context is war and treaty of musrikh of mecca and the verse 9.05 commands to kill them at them same time the verse 60.08

Here you go again, I have clearly asked you to study Qoran to render its verses justice.
You see abrogation? You are mixing up your subject, time and completely ignoring the different type of people the verse 6008 is talking about.
The "traditional "wound is too deep. Please heal yourself!

Verse 6008 has nothing to do with those who signed treaties!!!!! It is a general basic law regulation about any "disbeliever" that do not wish to fight you or be aggressors .

The verse after it 609 explains this clearly to you brother.

Brother here is a verse you need to remember
1827
You shall recite what is revealed to you of your Lord's scripture. Nothing shall abrogate His words, and you shall not find any other source beside it.

GOD bless you.
Peace.

imrankhawaja

Does it apply to you as well or you are imune to mistakes?

yeh it does apply to every human being , einstieen, all traditional/non traditional interpretators, historians , hadith makers, including me.. but lucikly i did not interpret anything yet

Yes al-kuffar is there but rejector is your insertion. I already said you can have any understanding but it is not binding for others to accept it

not mine lol,,

you still did not get it, its mean you need to understand things first regarding language , synonyms, meanings, wrong meaning, weak meanings, etc

all traditional scholars interpret kuffar as disbeliever /rejector on alll other places..

all correct translations use rejector/disbeleiver on other places including 57.20.. some of them are here and quite popular

5720 Know that this worldly life is no more than play and amusement, and boasting among you, and an increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to those who do not appreciate. Edip-Layth (Quran A Reformist Translation)

5720 Know that the worldly life is no more than play and distraction and adornments, and boasting among you, and to increase in wealth and children. It is like plants that are supplied by an abundant rain, which appear pleasing to the rejecters. The Monotheist Group (The Quran A Monotheist Translation)

5720 Know that this worldly life is no more than play and games, and boasting among you, and hoarding of money and children. It is like abundant rain that produces plants and pleases the disbelievers. Rashad Khalifa (The Final Testament)

Know that the life the present/worldly life (is) playing/amusement and a play thing/amusement , and decoration/ornament , and competing in pride/arrogance/glory between you, and multiplication in the properties/possessions and the children, as/like rain (that) its plants pleased the disbelievers (literal translation by traditional muslims lol )
yeah

some of the popular traditional translation now...

Know that the present life is but a sport and a diversion, an adornment and a cause for boasting among you, and a rivalry in wealth and children. It is as a rain whose vegetation pleases the unbelievers (Arberry)

Know that the worldly life is only a game, a temporary attraction, a means of boastfulness among yourselves and a place for multiplying your wealth and children. It is like the rain which produces plants that are attractive to the unbelievers (sarwar)

Know that the life of this world is but play and an amusement, and adornment, and a cause for boasting among you, a rivalry for greater riches and children. It is like rain whose vegetation pleases the unbelievers (Qaribullah)

RED i did not bind you to make beleive 2+2=4 ..its a proven fact... like kaffir is a proven fact its disbeleiver not a farmer...

matter of faith is same like God is also a proven fact but disbeliever/rejectors/kaffirs did not accpet this fact example is pharoah.. is pharoah was a king or farmer lol rotfl

Thanks for your judgement. I do not know which Quranic dictionary you are referring.

i did not create any dictionary of my own , if you are asking how to study quranic dictionary then refer my previous posts.. i even provide a link to you...

I do not think Arabic works like that. We have to understand Quranic terms with context, root meanings and idiomatic expressions/phrases.

God bless you

yeh thats what i m discussing with you ... with respect to this everything is crystal clear to you ... and for extra marks i provide you examples of both traditional and non traditional translation.. peace

God bless you too..

Neptin

I am in tears that you have called me fanatic about this Islam of brain and heart use. I am speechless that I am able to demonstrate that I stand against the evil of blind faith and terrorism of fake scholars.

Do not worry, I have been called an extremist by the so called moderate Sunnis who realise the grave problems with Hadith books but felt rejecting Hadith entirely is an extreme stand akin to accepting Hadith entirely. You know the kind of Sunnis that lie that they accept only Hadith that do not contradict Qur'an when in reality, they are mere cherry pickers who choose Hadith depending on their customs, lifestyle, scholar opinion or conscience. They only accept Qur'an verses as far as it agrees with scholar teachings. That is why they flagrantly violate Qur'an where their scholars defer from it. For instance, salat recitation must be moderately loud(according to Qur'an 17110) but they sometimes recite silently as males and always silently as females, since this is what their customs and scholars dictate.

Do not beat yourself over it, reel. You are no extremist or fanatic. You have enough rational and objective ground to reject Hadith entirely

parvez_mushtaq

Brother here is a verse you need to remember
1827
You shall recite what is revealed to you of your Lord's scripture. Nothing shall abrogate His words, and you shall not find any other source beside it.

GOD bless you.
Peace.

For your information ,GL
Two important aspects of the classical understanding of abrogation should be borne in mind. First, it emphasized that abrogation could only happen during the time of the Prophet, while the revelation was still being received. Second, the principle of abrogation could be applied only to sharia rulings, not to matters of faith or ethics or any information given in the quran, nor indeed to sharia rulings that have specific statements in the Quran attesting to their permanency.I wish you must have studied the traditional implication of abrogation before you try to argue about it .

Here you go again, I have clearly asked you to study Qoran to render its verses justice.
You see abrogation? You are mixing up your subject, time and completely ignoring the different type of people the verse 6008 is talking about.
The "traditional "wound is too deep. Please heal yourself!

Verse 6008 has nothing to do with those who signed treaties!!!!! It is a general basic law regulation about any "disbeliever" that do not wish to fight you or be aggressors .

The verse after it 609 explains this clearly to you brother.

Brother here is a verse you need to remember

Phiss, we take the entire Quran into consideration when it comes to knowing when war is correct...not a few verses. So you aren't gonna like if I say that a group can fight only with the ones who wronged them.

Let me quote the verse 60.09
Allah only forbids you from those who fight you because of religion and expel you from your homes and aid in your expulsion - that you make allies of them. And whoever makes allies of them, then it is those who are the wrongdoers.

but in verse 9.04(yusuf ali)
(But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements with them to the end of their term for Allah loveth the righteous.

who are these people ,Gl
For me , it seems , ayah 9.04 is the reflection of 60.08 and ayah 9.05 is the reflection of ayah 60.09 and both the verses are regrading the same people .In both the cases ALLAH subahnavtala gave the same rulings .can you prove they are NOT the same people then i you should have a strong evidence .can you give me that

For instance , if I take your understanding , from the verse 9.04 i should conclude once the treaty is over, even those who did not fought should be killed because they are polytheist because the verse 9.05 says kill the polytheist .again you are going hand in hand with those who gave the fatwa in IslamQA

parvez_mushtaq

I believe that the Quran is as clear as day regarding there being absolutely no compulsion in religion. And I find it sickening that so many "Muslims" such as ISIS want Hindus, Buddhists, even People of the Book and "non-orthodox" Muslims to convert to their twisted ultra-Wahhabi ideology or die. Let them worship God how they want to- that's what He says.

To put the Quran's opinion on people of non-Muslim/Kitaabi faiths simply- Live and let live!

The opening post has been updated .pl go thru OP once again
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608730.msg392421#msg392421

good_logic

Peace parvez.

The following is not my understanding, for sure,quote
For instance , if I take your understanding , from the verse 9.04 i should conclude once the treaty is over, even those who did not fought should be killed because they are polytheist because the verse 9.05 says kill the polytheist .again you are going hand in hand with those who gave the fatwa in IslamQA

That is your assumption,hence you conclude wrong.
Once the treaty is over,904 does not apply. Why should it, since there is no treaty to abide by?

Also brother,there is no abrogation and never has been with Qoran. Full stop.

Anyway ,I am failing miserably to understand you.
You say many things to confuse me and others on your stand ,yet you continue to support these secondary sources/arguments.
Thank you for the conversation brother,I will not be wasting any more time replying to you here.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

Novice

Thank you brother imran

This discussion is going nowhere because we have totally different views. I try to understand Quran by learning Quranic Arabic and you use translation for it. There will not be any agreement because you have to go a long way to learn Quranic language, Arabic root words and their application, provided you have the desire to learn the true message.

Like good logic said in another post and I quote it " if we disagree we disagree amicably."

God bless you

parvez_mushtaq

Peace parvez.

The following is not my understanding, for sure,quote
For instance , if I take your understanding , from the verse 9.04 i should conclude once the treaty is over, even those who did not fought should be killed because they are polytheist because the verse 9.05 says kill the polytheist .again you are going hand in hand with those who gave the fatwa in IslamQA

That is your assumption,hence you conclude wrong.
Once the treaty is over,904 does not apply. Why should it, since there is no treaty to abide by?

Also brother,there is no abrogation and never has been with Qoran. Full stop.

Anyway ,I am failing miserably to understand you.
You say many things to confuse me and others on your stand ,yet you continue to support these secondary sources/arguments.
Thank you for the conversation brother,I will not be wasting any more time replying to you here.
GOD bless you.
Peace.

So once the treaty is over then verse 09.05 applies

I am really surprised by your answer ,GL
It is not expected particularity from you ,that too a man of your caliber ,reputation and experience
I am disappointed

I have not confused you or anybody
firstly ,in short ,Abrogation is a phenomenon that happened in quran during the period of revelation and in will be used only on sharia rulings which may change due to the situations

secondly ,
a simple day to day person will never become a terrorists .so the prerequisite is that person should have under gone the unbearable atrocities .for example ,a Muslim from Iraq ,during war must have been tortured by the western army .assume that this person settled in US or UK . Let him be a salafi or a quranist .in both cases ,the ultimate derivation which he will obtain from quran is killing innocent people

let me coin the similarity between salafi and quraninst
salfis don't believe in terminological abrogation because it is a concept of shia so they want to believe in their tradition and give fatwa as in IslamQA
Quranist don't want to believe in abrogation because it is a concept of traditionalist so, as you said, it can be reasoned as i have derived from your reasoning in my previous post