Judge a faith by its founder, not by its followers
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That was one hell of a laugh Q Boy
lol lol lol lol lol lol
lol lol lol lol lol lol
lol lol lol lol lol lol
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I do not wish to offend, but to gain greater understanding, so I respectfully ask for your patience and consideration as I frame my thoughts in this post.
I have read about the life of Mohammed. His actions, including all the violence, his relationship with Aisha, etc., persuade me that he could not possibly have been a messenger of God as surely God's messengers are held to higher standards of behavior.
I have also studied the life of Jesus Christ. In Him I find no flaw. Yet, Mohammed asks us to believe that Jesus was a mere prophet and not the Son of God as Jesus himself claimed.
Mohammed's position just doesn't hold up and it seems so obvious to me that I'm amazed any educated person with a desire to seek truth could remain a Muslim. Those who claim Islam is a religion of peace must intentionally ignore very specific instructions in the Quran to the contrary and those who look at Mohammed's life must surely work very hard to defend his indefensible behavior.
Of course, many devices are used to justify or rationalize such problems away, for example the concept that Mohammed's later revelations supercede his earlier ones. Well, as just one example of illogical debate, that implies that God had trouble making up his mind while revealing truth to Mohammed, or that God sometimes got it wrong earlier on and had to make corrections, or that God chose a messenger incapable of getting the message right without repeated attempts, etc. This further applies to Mohammed's claim that both he and Jesus were prophets of God since Mohammed's writings in the Quran often contradict the teachings of Jesus. Since I don't believe God makes mistakes, it just doesn't add up for me.
Surely both Christians and Muslims, like men of all faiths, have done and will continue to do much wrong in the world. That's part of the human condition. So I say judge a faith by its founder and his teachings, not solely by people who claim to be followers of the faith. And when that is applied to Islam, I cannot possibly conclude that there is even a remote chance that Islam is true.
I encourage all on this board to do their homework and prayerfully seek God's guidance in their search for truth. I will check back occasionally as time permits to engage in discussion if reasonable replies warrant it, but I have to admit that I probably won't pay much attention to replies that start with the assumption that Mohammed was a prophet of God without addressing the concerns I raise above.
Thanks.
/oneway
u hit the jakephot here u r christen so u r safe from muslim because attacking jesus will hurt themselves but not me lol
u r right that u have to Judge a faith by its founder, not by its followers true very true so wut about u,r beloved Jesus born to a virgin mother wow now that makes sense n than he died 4 the sins of others that makes sense too lol don,t be happy i,m not agreeing with but i,m making fun of u twisted
u r judging mohammed wut about jesus wasn,t he a fake a fraud who claims the bigest lie in history being son of god
asked u,r own self does this make sense
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Salam D
Hey Bro Ahmed Bahgat, Im in line with ONEWAY. Can you stop using 'know-it-all' and arrogant tone in your posts? Maybe you didnt realize but I hope you will consider to change. wink
"O ye who believe! Let not some men/women among you laugh at others It may be that the (latter) are better than the (former)" (Al Quran 4911)
"Invite (all) to the way of your Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious." (Al Quran 16125)
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Salam D
Hey Bro Ahmed Bahgat, Im in line with ONEWAY. Can you stop using 'know-it-all' and arrogant tone in your posts? Maybe you didnt realize but I hope you will consider to change. wink
thanks for the comment, but I'm sorry i was taught not to give it away easy, only for the ones who deserve respect and his first comment here defaming mohammad and the Quran made him does not desreve respect, or you didn't read it,
so your advice or whatever has no merit in my book, sorry
"O ye who believe! Let not some men/women among you laugh at others It may be that the (latter) are better than the (former)" (Al Quran 4911)
"Invite (all) to the way of your Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious." (Al Quran 16125)
well according to the Quran, if you are a muslim, then you violated a big law in the Quran, firstly you didn't defend your religion against an infidel who is attacking it, secondly you are supporting an infidel against a muslim who is only defending against that infidel attacks, therefore you have no point
i have infidels who are friends because they don't defame my religion and i treat them according to 4911 and 16125 and many other verses, again you have no point
why don't you use these two verses on yourself and stop accsuing me of know it all, arrogant tone and all that BS, especially there is no conflict between me and you?, see, i got you red handed lol
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peace Ahmed,
two points i want to make.- just because a person calls themselves a 'christian' doesn't mean that they are not a believer. Being a 'muslim' is more than just saying 'i believe in one God and muhammad.' I believe that everyone who lives by the universal law (God's law) is a believer. Anyone who refuses to because they are too busy following their 'idols' are not. but that's just my belief. But whatever 'infidels' and 'believers' are, we are not the ones to judge. I think you'll agree.
- Jankren makes a good point about your posts. I don't mean to judge you, or insult you in anyway (just so you know), but i've noticed that your replies to posts that you don't agree with usually contain the words " very funny," "a joke," "thanks for the laugh" and the lol smilie. And it's not just on this thread and not just this person. If someone really is saying something ridiculous like "the earth is flat" then its fine. But if someone is trying to have a mature discussion and are giving their honest opinion or interpretation, then it is offensive. Not only to the person you replied to but also the people who agree with him/her. I like the contributions you make Ahmed, don't get me wrong. But our ultimate goal here is to learn something from the discussions and debates and invite other people to them as well. Your theatrics do neither of those things but in fact do the opposite.
Sorry about this long lecture. I'm pretty sure you already knew everything i said. I think you just needed a reminder. And i wanted to say these things because there are other members who do this as well. This post is for everyone
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peace Ahmed,
two points i want to make.- just because a person calls themselves a 'christian' doesn't mean that they are not a believer.
Peace phoenix1
come on bro, this is a christian with a conflict in hand , he is coming here to defame islam and the Quran, he is not a peaceful christian as far as i'm concerned, he is on the offensive or at least started as such
i do have many respectful christian friends, however all of them are kufar because they call jesus son of God, so according to the Quran if you are a christian and you call jesus the son of god then you are kafir regardless you are my friend or not
Being a 'muslim' is more than just saying 'i believe in one God and muhammad.
i believe
the criteria of the belief was clearly stated in the Quran, it is not really about Allah and Mohammad alone
it is about the belief in Allah, all his messnegers, all his books, the angels and the jusgment day, and if humans can do that then they can call themselves believers, submittiing should come soon after for the honest and serious ones
' I believe that everyone who lives by the universal law (God's law) is a believer.
which law bro?, i guess i stated the law above
Anyone who refuses to because they are too busy following their 'idols' are not.
sure
but that's just my belief. But whatever 'infidels' and 'believers' are, we are not the ones to judge.
well, i don't understand why you guys are critising me alone, he was the one that started the offensive in his very first comment and i acted accordingly and accroding to the Quran indeed
I think you'll agree.
I agree that anyone should have the freedom to believe in whatever and sure Allah is the only judge, but if your house is made of glass then don't throw stones on others, an eye for an eye as the bible says, so if some one comes and say we are flawed to follow the violent Quran and the normal human mohammad who was sort of a criminal, has no mecry in my eyes even if that person is calling the self a muslim, and even if that person is my blood brother
- Jankren makes a good point about your posts. I don't mean to judge you, or insult you in anyway (just so you know), but i've noticed that your replies to posts that you don't agree with usually contain the words " very funny," "a joke," "thanks for the laugh" and the lol smilie.
well, everyone has his/her own style, like danish for example, and i like his style despite i disgaree with many of his ideas, therefore i leave everyone's style in peace and don't whinge about it and i would like that everyone leave my style in peace, if the style is horrible i simply ignore that poster and i advice everyone to ignore my comments if my style is not suited to them, i do that with many here already
And it's not just on this thread and not just this person. If someone really is saying something ridiculous like "the earth is flat" then its fine. But if someone is trying to have a mature discussion and are giving their honest opinion or interpretation, then it is offensive.
again mate it is a mere style, like ahmad deedat who also makes jokes and fun in his debates, and many others that I know of
Not only to the person you replied to but also the people who agree with him/her.
of course it makes sense bro, the style will differ form both parties when there is a disagreement, as well everyone will love everypne when all agrees, can't see anyting strange here really
I like the contributions you make Ahmed, don't get me wrong. But our ultimate goal here is to learn something from the discussions and debates and invite other people to them as well. Your theatrics do neither of those things but in fact do the opposite.
Thanks bro but as i said mate, it is a mere style and very hard to change at the age of 40, and I receive many PMs of members that appreciate my comments that Allah knows for sure that I do it for Him and not for anyone else, as well Allah knows for sure that I'm being me and not pretending to be someone else, even my name is my real name
I'm a free man and i enjoy my freedom of saying what i want based on the circumstances in hand, I agree that my comments can take on an aggressive mode including some funny/sarcastic comments, but that is how it was planned when i commented, it is not like i was acting without knowing what i do,
the point is that i do the same with the closest family members, like father, wife, brother, mother etc etc, i.e. i'm being me, and honestly bro the people who knows me well loves me "alhamdullelah' despite my aggressive style
Sorry about this long lecture. I'm pretty sure you already knew everything i said. I think you just needed a reminder. And i wanted to say these things because there are other members who do this as well. This post is for everyone
no sorrow bro, i appreciate you advice, but i hope you understand my positionall people are the same for me when it comes to religion discussions, i don't deffrentiate nor discriminate between them if i see a flaw or a laughable comment by them within our discussions
however and sure i consider whom I'm debating with regarding the amount of sarcaism used but all balanced according to the words I receive from that person
at the ned of the day, no hard feelings on my end
peace mate