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  • MOVED: Quran inheritance mistake

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    This topic has been moved to Questions/Comments on the Quran. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=16179.0
  • How has the quranic research here helped you then?

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    Hi, Please take a few minutes if possible as i am sure it may provide reasons for people to turn to the research provided at by this forum. Thank You. How it helped me- one example. I have lots of spare time- in which I focus on things that are financially and socially more rewarding to me and others around me, rather then focusing on some useless ritual. Plus it has brought all my family members a lot more closer to one another and to me. To me after intensely studying the quran for a while I found that the salaat is merely consultation with people concerned about an issue (or seeking know how from those more knowledgeable about such a matter) ? a family matter financial or other. At the same time there are a lot of other everyday issues in the quran- which do help you to live better in any worldly environment. I am sure this forum must helped a lot of people but in different ways. Thanks All.
  • what is meant by "zeenat" in this verse?

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  • MOVED: bhuttos death

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    This topic has been moved to Discuss Latest News/Events. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=16160.0
  • A quest for truth, to hell with them.

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    Salaam everyone This is not news but asking for information Section on news & events has further informatin on this suject. Best regards farida Robert Fisk Do you know the truth about Lockerbie? I urge anyone who is aware of government lies over Flight 103 to come forward Published 13 October 2007 The Independent After writing about the "ravers" who regularly turn up at lectures to claim that President Bush/the CIA/the Pentagon/Mossad etc perpetrated the crimes against humanity of 11 September, I received a letter this week from Marion Irvine, who feared that members of her family run the risk of being just such "ravers" and "voices heard in the wilderness". Far from it. For Mrs Irvine was writing about Lockerbie, and, like her, I believe there are many dark and sinister corners to this atrocity. I'm not at all certain that the CIA did not have a scam drugs heist on board and I am not at all sure that the diminutive Libyan agent Megrahi ? ultimately convicted on the evidence of the memory of a Maltese tailor ? really arranged to plant the bomb on board Pan Am Flight 103 in December 1988. But I take Mrs Irvine's letter doubly seriously because her brother, Bill Cadman, was on board 103 and died in the night over Lockerbie 19 years ago. He was a sound engineer in London and Paris, travelling with his girlfriend Sophie ? who, of course, was also killed ? to spend Christmas with Sophie's aunt in the United States. Nothing, therefore, could be more eloquent than Mrs Irvine's own letter, which I must quote to you. She strongly doubts, she says, Libya's involvement in the bombing. "We have felt since the first days in December 1988," she writes, "that something was being hidden from us ... the discrediting of the Helsinki (US embassy) warning, the presence of the CIA on Scottish soil before the work of identifying bodies was properly undertaken, the Teflon behaviour of ministers and government all contributed to a deep feeling of unease. "This reached a peak when my father was told by a member of the American Presidential Commission on Aviation Security and Terrorism that our government knew what had happened but that the truth would not come out. In the truth vacuum, the worst-case scenario ? that lives were sacrificed in expiation for the Iranian lives lost in June 1988 ? takes on a certain degree of credibility. The plane was brought down in the last dangerous moments of the Reagan presidency." Now I should explain here that the Iranian lives to which Mrs Irvine refers were the Iranian passengers of an Airbus civilian airliner shot down over the Gulf by a US warship a few months before Lockerbie and before the end of the eight-year Iran-Iraq war. The USS Vincennes ? nicknamed Robocruiser by the crews of other American vessels ? blasted its missiles at the Airbus on the assumption that it was a diving Iranian air force jet. It wasn't ? and the Airbus was climbing ? but Reagan, after a few cursory apologies, blamed Iran for the slaughter, because it had refused to accept a UN ceasefire in the war with Iraq in which we were backing our old friend Saddam Hussein (yes, the same!). The US navy also awarded medals ? god spare us ? to the captain of the Vincennes and to his gunnery crew. Some weeks later the boss of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine General Command ? a pro-Iranian Palestinian outfit in Lebanon ? suddenly called a press conference in Beirut to deny to astonished reporters that he was involved in Lockerbie. Why? Was he being fingered? Was Iran? Only later did those familiar "official sources" who had initially pointed the finger at Iran start blaming Libya. By then we needed the support of Iran's ally Syria and Iranian quiescence in our attempt to liberate Kuwait after Saddam's 1990 invasion. Personally, I always thought that Lockerbie was revenge for the Airbus destruction ? the PLP's strange press conference lends credence to this ? which makes sense of Mrs Irvine's courageous letter. Her parents, Martin and Rita Cadman, have, she says, had countless meetings with MPs, including Tam Dalyell and Henry Bellingham, Cecil Parkinson, Robin Cook and Tony Blair, and with Nelson Mandela (whose appeal for Megrahi to be transferred to a Libyan prison was supported by the Cadmans). In a poignant sentence, Mrs Irvine adds that her parents "are ageing and in their anxiety that they will die with no one having taken real responsibility for their son's death are in danger of losing focus and feeling that they themselves are 'raving'. The (1980-8 war in Iraq meant that no lessons were being learned, and because my brother chanced to be on that plane we all now feel a heightened sense of responsibility for the world situation". Then Mrs Irvine comes to the point. "What can we do? Now that my father is older and it is up to us, the next generation, to try to needle the government, but is there any hope? I am writing to ask if you think there is any reasonable action that we can take that has a slight prospect of success ... a refusal to understand and admit to the past is dangerous for the future." I couldn't put it better myself ? and I do have a very direct idea. If official untruths were told about Lockerbie ? if skulduggery was covered up by the British and US governments and lies were told by those responsible for our security ? then many in authority know about this. I urge all those who may know of any such lies to write to me (snail mail or hand-delivered) at The Independent. They can address their letters to Mrs Irvine in an envelope with my name on it. In other words, this is an appeal for honest whistle-blowers to tell the truth. I can hear already the rustle of the lads in blue. Are we encouraging civil servants to break the Official Secrets Act? Certainly not. If lies were told, then officials should let us know, since the Official Secrets Act ? in this case ? would have been shamefully misused to keep them silent. If the truth has indeed been told, then no one is going to break the Official Secrets Act. So I await news. Ravers need not apply. But those who know truths which cannot be told can have the honour of revealing them all. It's the least Martin and Rita Cadman and Mrs Irvine ? and Bill and Sophie ? deserve. As for a constabulary which just might be tempted to threaten me ? or Mrs Irvine ? in a quest for truth, to hell with them.
  • Islamic Reform? When Camels Fly! (Louis Palme)

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    The following article is another criticism directed at the Reformist Translation. It is ironic, so far the two major criticism I received come from Christians. Is this a good sign or bad sign? Inshallah, I will post my response to the following article whenever I have a chance to write it. Peace, Edip Islamic Reform? When Camels Fly! By Louis Palme Sep 17, 2007 http//www.annaqed.com/en/content/show.aspx?aid=15887 Most people are optimists. They believe that, generally, the world is moving toward a better state of affairs and that people can ultimately solve the major problems they confront ? including epidemic disease and even global climate change. They believe that there is such a thing as ?good? and that it will ultimately prevail over anything that is ?evil.? And, above all, they believe in change as a positive occurrence. That is why people are optimistic about Islam. The religion must have some good elements because there are many truly good Muslims. While it is acknowledged that there are a number of problematic issues with Islam ? touching on basic human rights, tolerance, and separation of religion from politics -- the optimists of the world are confident that these can ultimately be overcome. After all, these are simply issues that need more attention by people who will seek the ?good? and make changes for the better. Such was the sentiment of Daniel Pipes in a recent article about calls to ban Islam or the Koran ?My take? I understand the security-based urge to exclude the Koran, Islam, and Muslims, but these efforts are too broad, sweeping up inspirational passages with objectionable ones, reformers with extremists, friends with foes. Also, they ignore the possibility of positive change.? Likewise, in the Muslim world, there are optimists like Irshad Manji who are yearning for a new Islam. She has actually launched ?Operation Ijtihad? to open once again the door to independent thought, initially through economic empowerment of women. ?When people are indoctrinated to believe that any aspect of the founding moment is sacred, then the faith is destined to become static, brittle, inhumane.? She goes on to say Before democracy can have legs in Arab Muslim countries, these countries need to be exposed to a competition of ideas. As I?ve been arguing, alternate interpretations of Islam can hold their own against the desert, even on the all-important symbolic level. That?s if we can get alternate interpretations disseminated, debated, aired, re-aired ? popularized. In the light of this optimism, how can someone cogently argue that Islamic Reform is little more than a hookah pipe dream? The answer boils down to three issues the nature of religious reform, the impediments to reform in Islam, and the inability of contemporary reformists to overcome those impediments. Religious Reform Whenever one thinks of religious reform, the Protestant Reformation touched off by Martin Luther comes to mind. What drove the young priest to nail his 95 theses to the door of the Wittenburg Castle Church in 1517 were the extra-Biblical excesses of the church of the day ? including the selling of indulgences (get-out-of-purgatory-free passes) to sinful but well-heeled believers. Luther devoted himself to getting back to the truth of the Bible and making it available to all people, initially via a translation of the Bible into German. Today, the disagreements between Protestantism and Catholicism are not so much over that sacred text as they are about some extra-Biblical ?traditions? that are still practiced by the Catholic Church, such as the veneration of Mary and the celibacy of priests. When the Protestant Reformation is taken as a model, Islamic Reform would involve a re-emphasis on the sacred text of the Koran along with stripping away any practices or traditions which are not associated with the Koran. In fact, there are today several ?Koran Only? movements which would have Muslims abandon the Hadith (the recorded sayings and acts of Muhammad) and Shari?a (the system of laws guiding Muslim activities). These movements include the United Submitters International, the Ahle Qur?an Group, and the Bazm-e-Tolu-e-Islam (Resurgence of Islam) Group. Their critics argue, however, that the Koran is unintelligible without the contextual information found in the hadith. Also, some of the basic practices of Islam including the statement of faith, the pillars of Islam, and the five daily prayers offered by Sunnis and Shiites aren?t fully defined in the Koran. Even more problematic, with regard to human rights, religious tolerance, and the separation of religion from politics, is the fact that the Koran itself provides the sacred mandates for these issues. Without belaboring this point with an exhaustive list of texts, here are a few examples Inequality of women God charges you, concerning your children to the male the like of the portion of two females. (Surah 4 11) And call in to witness two witnesses, men; or if the two be not men, then one man and two women, such witnesses as you approve of, that if one of the two women errs the other will remind her. (Surah 2282) Physical abuse of women And those you fear may be rebellious admonish; banish them to their couches, and beat them. (Surah 434) Protection of children O Prophet, when you divorce women, divorce them when they have reached their period . . . As for your women who have despaired of further menstruating, if you are in doubt, their period shall be three months, and those who have not menstruated as yet. (Emphasis added.) (Surah 651 ? 4) Inequality of non-Muslims Fight those who believe not in God and the Last Day and do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden ? such men as practice not the religion of truth, being of those who have been given the Book -- until they pay the tribute out of hand and have been humbled. (Surah 929) Cruel and abusive punishment And the thief, male and female cut off the hands of both, as a recompense for what they have earned, and a punishment exemplary from God. (Surah 53 Beheading captives When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then, when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds. (Surah 473) Taking of hostages and booty It is not for any Prophet to have prisoners until he make wide slaughter in the land . . . Eat of what you have taken as booty, such as is lawful and good. (Surah 870) Freedom of thought, including religion wish that you should disbelieve as they disbelieve, and then you would be equal; therefore take not to yourselves friends of them, until they emigrate in the way of God; then, if they turn their backs, take them, and slay them wherever you find them. (Surah 4 89) Intolerance of other religions O believers, fight the unbelievers who are near to you, and let them find in you a harshness; and know that God is with the godfearing. (Surah 9125) Separation of religion and politics That which you serve, apart from Him, is nothing but names yourselves have named, you and your fathers; God has sent down no authority touching them. Judgment belongs only to God. (Surah 1240) Consequently, any reform movement based simply on going back to the sacred text of the Koran only could lead to a religion which is no less inimical to 21st Century values regarding human rights, multi-culturalism, and the separation of church and state than the Islam currently practiced is such countries as Saudi Arabia and Iran. Islamic Impediments to Reform The Prophet of Islam told the believers that every word of the Koran is from God and a transcript is kept by God and is inscribed on an imperishable tablet. Clearly, any attempt to alter or edit this sacred book would be the height of blasphemy. Beginning in Muhammad?s time, however, non believers have suggested that the Koran was compiled by Muhammad himself, that it is full of errors and contradictions, and that it is theologically shallow. When the Koran is subjected to the same types of historical, linguistic, and textual analyses that the Bible and the Torah undergo on a daily basis, Muslims go ballistic. They accuse scholars of being Orientalists, irreverent, Islamophobic, and blasphemous. A few years ago, Dr. S. Parves Manzoor authored a diatribe against Western studies of the Islam and the Koran titled ?Method Against Truth.? He accused scholars of ?an unholy conspiracy to dislodge the Muslim Scripture from its firmly entrenched position as the epitome of historic authenticity and moral unassailability.? While he totally rejected what he called Orientalism, he acknowledged that ?sooner or later, authentic Muslim effort will have to approach the Koran from methodological assumptions and parameters that are radically at odds with the ones consecrated by our tradition. . . . The only proper method for the study of the Koran is the one that allows its truth to speak for itself. ? What are those methodological assumptions and parameters that are so onerous? First among them, according to Dr. Manzoor?s article, is any attempt to put the Koran into chronological order. He writes If the Koran itself may be understood as a chronological sequence of events, then whatever truth that it proclaims cannot be but temporal, and hence fallible. To introduce the category of ?secular? time in the ?sacred? event of revelation is, thus, to ?con-fuse? temporality with eternity. . . Given its ideological commitment, it may not be unfair to assume that the ultimate objective of the Orientalist chronological exercise is not to pronounce any judgment on the ?truth? of the Koran, but to spread confusion concerning its temporality and hence confound the unperceptive believer. In actuality, most translators of the Koran -- including Muhammad Marmaduke Pickthall and Muhammad Asad -- provide approximate dating of each surah. The most elementary step taken by anyone trying to understand a set of information (whether it is a jigsaw puzzle or evidence in a crime) is to put the information into some sort of logical order. That the Koran is compiled according to the length of the surahs is a logical order but not a particularly useful one with regard to understanding the ?truth? of the message contained within. If the Koran were truly a timeless and eternal holy text, then any sequence of the surahs and their coincidence with historical events in the life of Muhammad would be random and uninteresting. Actually, the opposite is true. This insight leads to two troubling possibilities 1) that verses in the Koran were created by Muhammad in response to real, instant situations he was facing; 2) that an analysis of contradicting statements would generally lead to discarding the former in favor of the latter. There is today an English rendering of the Koran in chronological order published by the Center for the Study of Political Islam. Not only are the verses in order and cross-referenced with historical events, but an Abridged Version eliminates the numerous redundant texts, thereby reducing the volume by 50%. The point of this particular rendering of the Koran is to demonstrate that Islam is a Political ideology, and the Koran along with the hadith and the histories of the life of Mohammed provide coherent chronology of Mohammed?s rise to political power. Another concern of Dr. Manzoor has to do with studies tracing the origins of the Koran. Clearly, there is a great deal of Biblical ?name dropping? in the Koran, but usually minus the moral messages of the original text. To the scholars? conclusion that much of the Koran was borrowed, Dr. Manzoor responds, ?Inasmuch as the Koran and the scriptures exhibit overlapping themes and motifs, even of linguistic expressions, it is due to the identity of the Transcendent Source of this knowledge and not attributable to any vagaries of its human recipients.? Of course, this explanation would not account for the numerous errors by the Transcendent Source, most notably, confusing Mary with Miriam (who lived 1500 years apart) or Gideon with Saul (who lived 170 years apart). A final general ?no go? area regarding the Koran has to do with the meaning of obscure words in the Koran. After all, the source of the Koran says, ?We have revealed the Koran in clear verses.? Unfortunately, when it was originally compiled after Muhammad?s death, there were no vowel markings in the Arabic script. Many consonant combinations could be read differently, as ?f_t? could be either fit or fat. Some of the words may have been derived from foreign sources, and so their meanings would be different depending on the original language. A good example of this is the dispute over whether the promise of paradise was 72 virgins or 72 raisins. To contest the ?traditional? interpretations, however, is fraught with danger. Attempts and Failures to Reform There have been many attempts to reform Islam going back to Ibn Rushd (?Averroes?) in the 12th Century. Often the reformists were banished or killed, their writings destroyed, and their followers dwindled away. In more recent times there have been two reform movements which showed promise -- Mahmoud Mohamed Taha who wrote The Second Message of Islam and an American Islamic Reform movement led by Edip Yuksel who recently published Quran ? A Reformist Translation. The Second Message of Islam is described as a ?humane and liberating understanding of Islam as an alternative to the cruel and oppressive interpretation underlying recent events in Iran, Pakistan, and Sudan, and equally negative traditionalist view prevailing in Saudi Arabia and other parts of the Muslim world.? What Taha observed is that prevailing Islamic practices, particularly Shari?a law, reflect the harsher mandates of the Medina Surahs in the Koran. (All but the last citation in the sampling of Koranic texts earlier in this essay were from the Medina period.) The portion of the Koran ?handed down? in Mecca was much more tolerant, humanitarian, and spiritual. He concluded that the latter was the true message of Islam, but the people had rejected it. Consequently, Muhammad had to first restore discipline and authority over the people until they reached the level of submission necessary to receive the true message, which was ?the Second Message of Islam? and was contained in the Mecca surahs. This ideal Islam was so superior to anything that existed, Taha concluded, that it has never been achieved by any nation to the present time. Mahmoud Taha was arrested for apostasy in Omdurman, Sudan, in December, 1984. In a trial that lasted barely two hours, he was condemned to be hanged. After the perfunctory appeals process, he was hanged, and his body was carried off by helicopter to be disposed in an undisclosed location in the desert. A small group of loyal followers continue to preach his ideology, but it has gained little traction in the Muslim community. No one, for example, has compiled a Koran containing only the Mecca surahs. As a reformed Islam, however, the Second Message of Islam would promote greater tolerance of non-Muslims, more respect for human rights and equality, and peaceful coexistence within a diverse community. But the movement failed to excise the offensive Medina verses from the Koran, and it didn?t manage to establish a community (much less, a country) that modeled the true message they espoused. Granted, the Sudan could hardly be called a place of religious or even racial tolerance. This year a team led by Edip Yuksel published Quran ? A Reformist Translation in the United States. It is described as a progressive translation, resonating powerfully with contemporary notions of gender equality, progressivism, and intellectual independence. Say the authors By presenting a peaceful and unifying message of the Quran, we hope to increase understanding and reduce tensions between the ?Muslim World? and people of other religions, especially those whom the Quran calls the People of the Book (Jews and Christians). . . We explicitly reject the right of the clergy to determine the likely meaning of disputed passages. . . e did not refer to books of Hadith and Sunnah, since they are commonly idolized and associated partners with the Quran. Their perceived value is wrongly based on the sanctified names of the narrators and the authority of the collectors, rather than their substance. . . When we assert that God alone is the authority in defining the system of Islam, we mean that no signature and no authority beside God will be considered as justification for the truth-value of a proposition regarding Islam. . . Each of us is responsible for our own understanding. Therefore, we promote Islamic reformation in Muslim societies by inviting them to dedicate their religion to God alone by upholding the Quran alone as the only source of their religion. One of the noteworthy features of this version of the Koran is the extensive use of footnotes cross-referencing the text with the Bible. There are also several Appendices dealing with extra-Koranic sources, definitions of general religious concepts, and topics related to Edip Yuksel?s own pet Koranic mystery ? the cryptic reference to ?nineteen? in Surah 7430. While the Reformist Translation contains a wealth of insights into the Koran, Arabic, and the not-so-subtle agendas of the original compliers and commentators of the Koran, it remains an English translation. Other than advocating that Muslims adopt a Koran-only religion, the original Arabic Koran remains intact. As we will see below, some of the softening of the Koran by this reformist translation boils down to selecting milder, and sometimes far-fetched, alternate wording for the text. In other cases, a directive statement is put in the passive voice, changing a command to a mere statement of prophetic fact. This approach cannot change the original Arabic, and it is questionable if the methodology could be applied equally to French, German, or Indonesian translations of the Koran. At the beginning of this essay was a list of passages from the Koran which would be problematic from the point of view of human rights, religious tolerance, and separation of religion from politics. As was previously noted, all but the last citation were from Surahs written during the militant Medina period of the Koran?s revelation. The way the Reformist Translation dealt with many of these verses was to find less offensive renderings of the Arabic into English ? Inequality of women -- Surah 411 (No change) Surah 2282 (No change) Physical abuse of women -- Surah 434 ?beat? becomes ?separate? Protection of children ?- Surah 651-4 (Reference to those who have not menstruated as yet is dropped from the reformist rendering.) Inequality of non-Muslims ?- Surah 929 (A long footnote explains that the tribute (jizya) was actually reparations paid by two defeated Bedouin clans in the Battle of Hunayn, 629 A.D., and the verse was therefore a command specific to that incident. Not only does this explanation contradict the account in the History of al Tabari (Volume IX, paras. 1654 ? 1676) and overlook the fact that the text was specifically about the People of the Book, but it also ignores the 1,400 year tradition of dhimmis paying jizya for protection while living as non-Muslims in Muslim countries.) Cruel and abusive punishment ? Surah 538 ?cut off the hands? becomes ?mark, cut, or cut off their hands/means? Beheading captives ? Surah 473 ?So, if you encounter those who have rejected, then strike the control center until you overcome them. Then bind them securely.? (Emphasis added.) Taking of hostages and booty ? Surah 870 ?wide slaughter in the land? becomes ?battle?; ?booty? becomes ?what you have gained? Freedom of thought, including religion ? Surah 489 (No change) Intolerance of other religions ? Surah 9125 ?unbelievers? becomes ?ingrates?; ?harshness? becomes ?strength? Separation of religion and politics ? Surah 1240 (No change) From this brief sampling of problematic verses, it can be seen that the Reformist Translation has attempted to alleviate some of them, at least by finding less offensive English renderings of the original Arabic. (The continuing practice publicly beheading criminals, severing the hands of thieves, and beating wives with impunity in Saudi Arabia indicates that there is no confusion there about the real meaning of the Arabic texts.) So in this sense, the Reformist Translation is no more than a cosmetic change, and it can?t be considered substantive reform. Perhaps the best one can hope for as an outcome of this huge undertaking by Mr. Yuksel and his colleagues is that it will promote more conversations and dialogues about disregarding the hadith and other extra-Koranic texts used by Muslims. To gain momentum, however, this reformist movement will have to overcome over a millennium of these texts being an integral part of Islam. Further, the movement will have to deal with the well-funded opposition of countries like Saudi Arabia who have a vested interest in maintaining all the practices and rituals of Islam which are sustained by the hadith and the Shari?a. Nevertheless, this new reformist translation of the Koran may be the catalyst which will break the logjam that has kept Islam mired in the 7th Century. Even that would be a change for the better. Endnotes http//www.danielpipes.org/article/4868 The Trouble With Islam, p. 155 ibid., p. 171 Quotations from the Koran are taken from A.J. Arberrry, The Koran Interpreted, 1955, which is claimed to come closest to conveying the impression made on Muslims by the original Arabic. See Surahs 431 and 8522 See Surahs 1591, 16101, 215, 254-5, 3443, 467-8, and 7424-25 http//www.islamonline.net/english/Contemporary/2003/08/article03a.shtml. This article was selected because it is relatively concise, yet it contains arguments similar to those reflected in larger works, such as Edward Said?s Orientalism A Simple Koran, Center for the Study of Political Islam, 2006, via www.cspipublishing.com For example, the Koran says that Jonah was sent with a message (Surah 37142), but nowhere in the Koran is the reader told what the message was. The message is only found in the Bible, in Jonah 12, that the city of Nineveh was to be destroyed because of its wickedness. Compare Surah 335-40 with the information in the Bible, Numbers 2659, regarding Miriam, and Surah 2249 with the Biblical accounts in Judges, Chapter 7, and I Samuel, Chapter 10, regarding Saul and Gideon. Surah 2216 The Second Message of Islam, 1987, page 1 Compare Surah 2562-76, ?handed down? in Mecca, with Surah 9, one of the last Surahs, ?handed down? in Medina. This book has met with organized opposition and may not be available in bookstores. It can be obtained through the publisher at www.brainbowpress.com or via www.islamicreform.org. Pages 11-12 Page 406 For example, the troubling command in Surah 533 ?This is the recompense of those who fight against God and His Messenger, and hasten about the earth, to do corruption there They shall be slaughtered, or crucified, or their hands and feet shall alternately be struck off, or they shall be banished from the land? is changed to ?The recompense for those who fight God and His messenger and seek to corrupt the land is that they will be killed or crucified . . . .? (Emphasis added.)
  • MOVED: Childhood Immunizations?

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    This topic has been moved to Off-Topic. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=15757.0
  • Anti-terrorist cartoons in the Arab press

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    http//www.memri.org/bin/latestnews.cgi?ID=IA39807
  • A Satanic Cult Rules the World

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    A Satanic Cult Rules the World by Henry Makow Ph.D. October 16, 2007 "How can one chase a thousand, and two put ten thousand to flight unless...God had delivered them into enemy hands?" Deuteronomy 3230 "Either convert to Islam or be executed." This was the choice the Turkish Sultan gave Sabbatai Zevi, self-proclaimed Jewish "Messiah" in 1666. By only pretending to convert, Zevi resorted to a common practice. But Zevi was not an ordinary Jew. He led a popular heresy, based on a satanic strain of Cabalism. The rabbis had denounced him and his followers. After his "conversion," millions of followers, who later included financiers like the Rothschilds, imitated his example. But they didn't just pretend to be Muslims or Christians. They pretended to be Jews as well. By adopting this chameleon strategy, this satanic cult infiltrated and subverted most governments and religions, and established an invisible tyranny without drawing much attention. In the words of the gifted researcher Clifford Shack "Through infiltration, stealth and cunning, this invisible network has come to rule us all. Forty-one years after Shabbatai Zevi's death, in 1717, they would infiltrate Masonry guilds in England and establish Freemasonry.... Jacob Frank would have a great impact on the inner core of Freemasonry known as the Illuminati, formed in 1776. Freemasonry would become the hidden force behind events like the revolutions, the creations of the U.N. & Israel, both World Wars (including the Holocaust!), and the assassinations of the Kennedy brothers who, together with their father, tried to thwart the efforts of the network on American soil. Sabbatean/Frankists, also referred to as the "Cult of the All-Seeing Eye" (look on the back of your one dollar bill to begin to understand their influence in YOUR life), are political and religious chameleons. They are everywhere. Everywhere where there is power. They are the good guys AND the bad guys. The World War Two era is a prime example. The following leaders were members of the "Cult of the All-Seeing Eye" (Sabbatean/Frankists) Franklin D. Roosevelt; Winston Churchill; Adolph Hitler; Eugenio Pacelli (Pope Pius XII); Francisco Franco; Benito Mussolini; Hirohito and Mao Tse-Tung." IMPLICATIONS If Mr. Shack is correct, historians, educators and journalists collaborate in this satanic conspiracy by upholding a false reality and distracting us from the truth. Our world, our perception of the human experience, are shaped by an occult secret society. Our culture is an elaborate psy-op. Obviously, the Sabbateans and their descendants should consume our study. (Instead, they are hidden from view.) They were decisive in the so-called "Enlightenment," "secularism" and "modernism," which are but baby steps to their Satanism. According to Rabbi Marvin Antelman, they believe sin is holy and should be practised for its own sake. Since the Messiah will come when people either become righteous or totally corrupt, the Sabbateans opted for debauchery "Since we cannot all be saints, let us all be sinners." Their blasphemous benediction "who permits the forbidden" later became the Illuminist "do as thou wilt" the expression of their "religious" feeling. Totally amoral, they believe the "end justifies the means." ("To Eliminate the Opiate,"Vol. 2 p. 87) In 1756, Jacob Frank and his followers were excommunicated by the rabbis. Antelman says the Sabbateans were behind the Reform, Liberal and Revolutionary Movements of the Nineteenth century. They were also behind the Reform and Conservative movements in Judaism, including the "Haskalah" i.e. assimilation. In other words, many Jews may be influenced by the Sabbateans and not even know it. That is their tactic. They dont advocate Satanism. They gently steer you that way by questioning the existence of God, by demanding "sexual liberation," "independence" for women, "internationalism," "diversity" and "religious toleration." SEXUAL EXCESS AS RELIGION We think "free sex" is "progressive and modern." In fact, they have partly inducted us into their cult. The Sabbatean sect has indulged in wife sharing, sex orgies, adultery and incest for more than 350 years. They also promoted interracial sex. Antelman cites the proceedings of a rabbinical court where Shmuel, son of Shlomo tearfully confessed he had rejected the Torah and had encouraged his wife to have sex several times with Hershel. "I am guilty. She did not want to." (111) Sexual abandon is characteristic of Communism, a direct outgrowth of Sabbateanism. Jacob Frank pimped his beautiful wife to recruit influential men. Female members of the Communist Party were used in the same way. An anecdote that has always bothered me is pertinent. In "The Other Side of Deception" Mossad defector Victor Ostrovsky described how the Mossad relax. At a party, the staff, including many unmarried young females, congregated around a pool, totally naked. THE "HOLOCAUST" The influence of the Sabbatean conspiracy is hidden in plain sight. For example, the term "Holocaust" is used without regard to its true meaning. Rabbi Antelman states that before World War Two, it meant "burnt offering" as in sacrifice. (p.199) He quotes Bruno Bettleheim who says "calling the most callous, most brutal, most horrid. most heinous mass murder a 'burnt offering' is a sacrilege, a profanation of God and man." (205) Whose sacrifice was it? For what purpose? Obviously, it has something to do with the Sabbateans' occult practice. Every time we use that word, we unwittingly join in their sacrilege. According to Antelman, the Sabbateans hated Jews and sought their extinction. He cites rabbis who warned as far back as 1750 that if the Jews didnt eradicate the Sabbateans, they would be destroyed by them. (209) And indeed when some Jews tried to save European Jewry from genocide, Antelman says "the conservative and reform communities went their merry way ignoring these activities. So called establishment organizations like the American Jewish Congress, American Jewish Committee, and B'nai Brith did virtually nothing." (217) INTERMARRIAGE Sabbateans only marry within their demonic sect. They often marry rich, influential Gentiles. Thus, the Fourth Baron Rothschild (Jacob's) mother was not Jewish nor is his wife. Another example is Al Gore's daughter Karenna's 1997 marriage to Andrew Schiff, the great grandson of Jacob Schiff. Gore's father was a Senator sponsored by Armand Hammer (Occidental Petroleum) whose own father was the founder of the American Communist party. Like Hitlery and Dubya, Al Gore is another Illuminati agent. His Nobel Prize proves it. David Icke has a list of Satanists and it is just a beginning. CONCLUSION Mankind is in the grip of a vicious Satanic cult whose power is so great, they can make us see their war against humanity as normal and inevitable. Even when their plot is exposed, they can convince everyone that it is racist and in bad taste to believe it. They have the public masturbating to porn while they erect a police state. Western society is morally bankrupt. This tightly knit cult controls politics, information and culture. Most leaders are dupes or traitors. The "Intelligentsia" has been bribed while the public lives in a fool's paradise. Like most nations and religions, Jews have been subverted from within. Zionists are pawns of the Sabbateans who used the "holocaust" to engineer the creation of Israel. Millions of Jews may have been "sacrificed" to create a Sabbatean Homeland, a "burnt offering" to Satan. God gave man Life a Miracle full of inherent Beauty and Meaning. He gave us everything we need to develop according to his Plan. But people who think limitless power and wealth are better than infinite love have hijacked humanity. They want to spoil our Divine Rendezvous and enslave us instead. This is the real meaning of our politics and our time. Related Posed for Gay Porn, Schwarzenagger Introduces Homosexuality to CA Schools List of 45 Republican Pedophiles Why Do the Illuminati Hate Jews? Henry Makow Ph.D. is the author of "Cruel Hoax Feminism and the New World Order." (www.cruelhoax.ca) His articles can be found at his web site www.henrymakow.com He enjoys receiving comments, some of which he posts on his site using first names only. [email protected]
  • Nice video about the Danish cartoon controversy

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    Nice video about the cartoon controversy and the later riots http//svt.se/svt/play/video.jsp?a=930123 After intro its in English
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    This topic has been moved to Questions/Comments on the Quran. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=15615.0
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    Dear brothers, Peace be upon you all! I would appreciate if anyone of you could quote references of all those hadith including the chain of narrators which describes that Prophet Mohamed was spelled witchcraft and he suffered out of it. I'm in a desperate need of this information as I'm doing a research. Thanking you in anticipation, Kind regards,
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  • similarities between Judaism and sectarian Islam

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    In some ways the Jewish Talmud is considered even more important to the present Jewish faith than the Hebrew Scriptures. Jewish tradition holds that Moses received two Torahs on Mount Sinai. One was a written Torah (contained in the Five Books of Moses known as the Pentateuch). The second was an oral Torah, which according to Jewish tradition was passed from Moses to religious leaders (such as rabbis) from century to century. At the end of the second century of the Common Era (AD) this oral tradition was codified and written down. It was called the Mishnah (Hebrew for "instruction&quot. A discussion of the Mishnah took place in the academies of Babylonia between the years 200 and 600 CE. The edited and redacted transcript of those discussions and dissertations on the Mishnah is called the Gemara (Aramaic for "completion&quot. Together, Mishnah and Gemara comprise the Talmud (the written record of what Jews believe is Moses' oral Torah, its meaning, and application). & http//www.new-life.net/talmud.htm
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    Peace all, http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talkKFP#FREE_MINDS_page.2C_REQUESTING_RESTORATION If anyone still wants the article up, I suggest, in particular brother Layth, to put up the motto "YOU help us understand the Quran in a better way" on the front page of this site. GOD Bless!
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    This topic has been moved to Hadith Discussions. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=15146.0
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