Salat & Zakat

peace, Can you expand upon "Since ? duluk shams ? means decline of the sun at its zenith or the disapearance of the solar disc depending on arab dictionaries, and arab prepositions (harf jar), such as ? ? the end of time window, then, it becomes impossible for the first defintino to be plausible." Also, you may find point 11 in this interesting http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/problems-5-salat-Quran.html And with regard to 4102 analysis see http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-of-SuJuD-from-Quran.html salam, and about the meaning I give to the salat wusta, what do you think ?? ps I speak bad English, sorry

http//www.islamawakened.com/quran/24/41/w4wbv.html term "salat" is something differently of term "tas'bih"

I meant to update this thread too. Here is my study on it http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-SaBiH-from-Quran.html#part2

Salaam all, Thank you for your insights. I have done more research and gotten answers from those of other faiths since my last post. One of you said that "Muslim" Salat is a rip off of Zoroastrian "Namaz". It seems this is correct. I have learned from a Zoroastrian acquaintance that they also pray 5 times a day AND break their prayer into units. Considering that the 6 Hadith compilers (fabricators) were from Persia, this makes complete sense. And MOF, as for Salat positions being symbolic & not physical, with all due respect, I disagree. Look at the ancient religions from Arabia that still exist today & you will find that Gods Sunnah (way) doesn't change. The Jews, Sabeans (Mandaeans), Zoroastrians & Yazidis all STAND, BOW & PROSTRATE. And they all perform ablution. It is what it is and it has always been that way . That's how it looks according to all the evidence. And Quran gives us no reason to think otherwise. Peace! Aamer. As far as Rikat you need to look at Judaism for that. They also have Rakat units. Whats interesting is that Sunni sources claim Muhammad prayed twice a day before his night journey they claim. They have a hard time explaining that since they use that how do you guys know how to pray from the Quran arguments against us. I now answer them by saying the same way Muhamad knew how to pray before Gabriel supposedly taught him how to pray. You are right about prayers in ancient times, The same could be said of many religions like Hinduism and Shintoism praying that way also.

I think that is feasible. It at least makes more sense than just hail and handshake and bye bye

I've come to the conclusion that the ritual Salat is the Mutasyaabihat. It is self evident . . . even to the hadithers.

Peace Bender. Thank you for your clarification. I take it you do not know what "Aquimi salat" is yet, and you are still looking for other options? Salaam, No, I have for myself a clear understanding of what "Aquimi salat" means, I believe my understanding fits perfectly in every verse where the word sallaat is mentioned. BUT I am always in search for something better or even if it is not better I still like to learn how people see things, that is imo also very important for various reasons. Of course I am not here to provide satisfying answers for anyone. Your Lord is the one who has your answers. Keep pondering and studying Qoran. Have more patience. I am giving my views like you are. Others can take what is best from all the views or leave alone all together. handshake BLUE It's a good thing to know how Allah gives answers to questions. May be you realise and are aware of this , I know I am 1331 Even if a Qoran caused mountains to move, or the earth to tear asunder, or the dead to speak (some will not believe). God controls all things. Is it not time for the believers to give up and realize that if God willed, He could have guided all the people? ... GOD bless you. Peace. Well I guess were are here just to discuss and share views, I am not trying to convince anyone here about my beliefs and I think (=hope) the same goes for you. handshake Bender

Peace, not emotionality or sensuality, be your state always, The God has based all life on Laws. If there is something that applies to only a sect of people, you are on the wrong path. Only that which is universal can be right. We cannot say Jesus is savior because what about people before Jesus? Not universal. We cannot say you must literally bow and prostrate and do 5 rakats because it is not universal. However when you understand the metaphor of such statements , you understand there is something psychological being pointed to. Please look at this thread again and let's discuss.

Peace to all. whatever

Who said zakat is giving Money? In the past People using coins used to be very few,most of the People exchanged what they?ve produced. In the great reading it is twisted with salat so it has also spirituel form of giving purity.

Peace 357. It all depends on what you mean by "prosperity"? An example of prosperity Pharaoh! Before the Moses episode was prosperous? He had his kingdom on earth? His people were prosperous? At that time what would you have called his country/people? Prosperity for all except for some Israelites who were slaves to them? GOD bless you. Peace. 1959 ?Then after them came those degenerates who missed "salaat" and followed their desires, then soon they will encounter a valley of the hell. Well you said it , for not doing their salaat (with the Israelites&quot Pharoeh and co did end up in the valley of hell, and you don't need to wait till some judgment day , its all in history. If he had been doing his salaat with them - he would have observed their rights also and thus his and their prosperity both. Thanks.

Peace Man of Faith, You misunderstand! "They are the ones whose works in this life are totally astray, but they think that they are doing good." These people exist, they have their "good" and others being right/good as per Quran will not end their existence....sorry. Have a blessed Ramadan peace Yes, they think they are doing good, but if they gave it a little bit more thought they would know it is wrong. Peace

5040 says... 5039-40 glorify with praise before rising of the sun and before setting of the sun and from the night so glorify Him and after ends of the acknowledgement/SJD Thus, within and after would be the correct interpretation

Salaam Nice video, but why you just standing in there on the whole time. Personally my salat still has some hadith and Tanakh influence (to avoid many assumptions) For me hadith and Tanakh is not innovations but corrupted, so I believe some clearness existed in there. Ablution Simple I follow both 56 and some hadith and I understand the word junub also based on hadith. For time salat, I practice daily three times + supplication (tahajud and jumu'ah) (11114) The word tarafy al nahr means two ends of days and I assume it's fajr/morning and dusk Based on Fajr/dawn = (177 Guduwwa (&#1617 or early morning (7205, 2436) Dusk/Asaali (7205, 2436, 3342, 7625) The green phrase, I assume it's middle night salat/also known as tahajud, based on (1779) (1779) Middle player Al-Salawati indeed is a plural, and plural in Arabic is more than two. I assume Al-Salawati is the salat between fajr and dusk or middle day. NOTE I'm also uphold friday prayer and I assume it's Sabbath according to the Quran and hadith. My salat movements is similiar with traditional one. What I recite is Al-Fateha, some Quranic surah and sometime I also recite Psalm in Arabic. Just my 2 cents

Since the formatting will be gone if i copy & paste, here are the links to the first articles (feel free to check around at the other articles at the website) (This is not my article, nor do I endorse all of the views, but it's somewhat enlightening) <a href="http//neutralfiles.com/index.php/%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D9%88%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%AD%D9%83%D8%A7%D9%85/%D8%A3%D8%A8%D8%AD%D8%A7%D8%AB-%D9%81%D9%8A-%D9%85%D9%88%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B5%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%A9/226-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B5%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%A9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%AD%D9%82%D9%8A%D9%82%D9%8A%D8%A9-%D9%84%D9%83%D9%84-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D9%86%D8%A8%D9%8A%D8%A7%D8%A1"> </a> <a href="http//neutralfiles.com/index.php/%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%A7%D8%AA-%D9%88%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%AD%D9%83%D8%A7%D9%85/%D8%A3%D8%A8%D8%AD%D8%A7%D8%AB-%D9%81%D9%8A-%D9%85%D9%88%D8%B6%D9%88%D8%B9-%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B5%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%A9/236-2"> - 2 </a> Thank you TheQuranAloneRevolution, for your info about this site. After browse this site, I really recomemmend for all free-minds to see this site. http//neutralfiles.com/ This site is about quran alone movement in arabic There are also many video showing persons ( not anonymous) present their idea about quran alone view of Islam Discussion in arabic regarding quran alone is very interested and effective. No issue about language capabilty, about arabic grammar and rule, etc. Quran verse is presented directly, no translation I hope you can support this site, and can take something useful to apply Muawiya Murti

I agree with almost everything you wrote in your response, except the red part in the following qoute Sometimes terms makes people confused. Try to look at it from this point of view Sadaqa = justification of citizenship payed willingly by the believers = 20% of salary Jizya = justification of citizenship payed by force by those who uphold other systems than islam = 20% of salary Zakat = voluntary charity, be it money, a smile, or a hug to someone who needs it Is the problem solved? Peace Peace, I think you misunderstood what I meant. Taxes become obvious in a society and it is simply expected without anyone giving it much thought about its charitable nature. You can become a proud tax payer though if you see that the money is for the greater good. No incompatibility there. The society with a well-functioning welfare system such as the one in some secular countries, and if many believed in God, would be the best in the "eyes" of God. That people drift away from belief in God in countries is another issue, but as long as they keep a justice system of God's "standard" then God would at least keep it without destroying it. If God would destroy all communities for their sins He would not leave a tiny piece of land anywhere because most people do not believe 12103 And most of the people, even if you are diligent, will not believe. 3545 And if God were to punish the people for what they have earned, He would not leave a single creature standing. But He delays them to an appointed term. So, when their time comes, then God is Seer of His servants. Is the world not interesting? God says that most people do not believe and most that do believe associate partners with Him. 12106 And most of them will not believe in God except while setting up partners. But half the Faith is about establishing a God-compatible system, so those who uphold justice and do what is right are half-way. In fact more so than hypocrites that run around with AK-47s yelling "Allahu Akbar" and that ritualistically pray and then mention others alongside God's name in their Mosques, in countries with no need to mention names. They are worse than disbelievers that uphold a decent judicial system in the western world. Evil deeds and corruption are worse than being an atheist. There are more verses that talk about behavior and deeds than about "religious rules", but people seem to miss this fact. The Book teaches well how to establish a society and politics, and most Western countries, at least Sweden which I can speak for, already has a similar system to the one that God teaches with The Book. In fact those who keep "Christian values" uphold a system of God. Away with the Jesus obsession and you have a upright community that serves God. God knows that the majority of people do not believe and as long as the communities are not severely transgressing and uphold a compatible system, then God will not destroy them, especially not if there is even but one person within the society that believes. Your elaboration on Zakat is fine. Sorry for running slightly off-topic. God bless you

peace, Now compare it with the following {God has affirmed, that the vision of His messenger will come true "You will enter the Masjidu'l Haram, God willing, secure, with your helmets removed, and having arms at the ready." Thus, He knew what you did not know, and He has appointed before this a conquest near at hand}... According to the Arabic 4827 says "...muhalliqeena ruoosakum wa muqassireena la takhafoona..." implying a contrast between "la takhafoona" (not fearing) and what came before i.e. "muhalliqeena ruoosakum wa muqassireena". Being secure with helmets removed seems to conflict with having arms at the ready and not fearing. In fact, one could argue that this rendition is contradictory, because in 4101 it clearly says "if you fear....." do XYZ in what follows, and in 4827 it is about "not fearing". In other words if you fear ---> arms at the ready not fearing ----> arms at the ready In any case, the following is my research, which I consider much more accurate From http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-masjid-al-haram-Quran.html 4827 Certainly, God has confirmed His messenger's vision*** with truth/reality, surely you (plural) will enter al masjid al haram, if God wills, securing/trusting, unburdening/relieving your chiefs/representatives****, and restraining/relinquishing not fearing. So, He knew what you did not know, and He made besides that a victory near/close. 4828 He is the One who sent His messenger with the guidance and the system/obligation of truth, so that it would expose all other systems. And God is sufficient as a witness. *** Arabic 'al ruya' (dream/vision), see analysis of 171-7 and 1760 **** see discussion of 2196 above. Many translators interpolate "hair" and imply the "wa/and" which follows means "or" to make their rendition fit better.

AlSalat Alwusta is Not a noun, it is an adjective. It is a phrase; adjectival phrase. Adjectival description of first noun is given by a Comparative Noun; Definite; Singular; feminine; genitive, exactly matching on all counts with the described one. Its Root is " ". For convenience, an entry from Lane's Lexicon is reproduced hereunder properly, the part of which several lateral, or outer, portions are equal; as, for instance, the middle finger but also meaning the part which is surrounded, or enclosed, on its several sides, although unequally (Msb) or the part that is between the two sides or extremities of a thing; (M, IB, Mgh, K as, for instance, the centre of a circle] Grammatical analysis and parsing of 2238 Detailed article on As-Salat Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance The Key of the door of success

Peace Ali, Greeting fellow earthlings, I am trying to compile a method in which I am able to conduct my daily prayers. Like what to say, what to do etc. I was wondering, in regards to what to say, if you want to take an extract from a variety of verses and put them together in a way that would indicate you are asking for forgiveness for example, would it be okay to do that? Like for instance, pick out a verse, something in it that you like, and you take out a portion of it to use in your prayer, is that permissible? Also, are there any verses which tell you what positions you must do, what order, or is it possible to just face the kaaba in a prostrating, or standing, or bowing position and recite your prayer? Personally, I pray the traditional sunni way, but with modifications. However, I don't think the actual form is very important. The Quran mentions standing, bowing, prostration, direction, and the glorification of God in the state of prostration, so I think it's clear that the early Muslims simply copied Muhammad's chosen way to do so. I also prefer to read from the Quran while standing, instead of just recite the same verses that I know off by heart. It's a great method to read more of the Quran. After the part "sami3ah l-laaha liman hamidah" I quote verse 17110-111. I think it's very appropriate for that position. Then in the bent and prostrated positions I make the necessary tasbeeh, which is already a part of normal salah Finally in the seated position I start the tahiyyaat in the normal way. I omit the direct stuff spoken to Muhammad because I think it's heretical. Then I make the shahadah, but without the reference to Muhammad. My shahadah is simply Then I recite relevant verses from the Quran. I've created a list of such verses for myself and change them occasionally, but for now this is the one I like most 2136 "We believe in God, and in that which has been bestowed from on high upon us, and that which has been bestowed upon Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and ,their descendants,111 and that which has been vouchsafed to Moses and Jesus; and that which has been vouchsafed to all the prophets by their Sustainer we make no distinction between any of them.112 And it is unto Him that we surrender ourselves." 6162-163 "My contact prayer, my devotion and offerings, my life, and my death, are all to God the Lord of the worlds." 4615 "My Lord, enable me to be grateful for Your favor which You have bestowed upon me and upon my parents and to work righteousness of which You will approve and make righteous for me my offspring. Indeed, I have repented to You, and indeed, I am of the Muslims." 38 (Our Lord, make not our hearts to swerve after that Thou hast guided us; and give us mercy from Thee; Thou art the Giver) 2201 'Our Lord, give to us in this world good, and good in the world to come, and guard us against the chastisement of the fire' 1440 ( &#1569 O my Sustainer, cause me and of my offspring to remain constant in prayer!54 "And, O our Sustainer, accept this my prayer So that's my prayer at the moment. Those verses are all quotes from people like Ibrahim and others used as examples in the Quran. Whenever I come across such a verse I write it down, and every now and then I rotate them or add new ones that speak to me at that moment.

Earthdom, In my view the regular/timed salat e.g. 'salat al fajr' (salat/bond of dawn) is synonymous with 'quran al fajr' (reading/recitation of dawn). For further reading see the article I linked to.