If "Only Allah", then "Allah Alone" is our watchword

runninglikezebras

And so Who knows who are the other messengers Allah had talked to directly, except Allah? Therefore what is there in Quran is an inducement for you to turn to Allah for more, and speak with Him directly for more; and wait in patience expecting to listen to Him when He speaks to you heart to heart. Turn to Allah and turn off your dictionaries.

Look at the verbs being used (difference between "give words"/"speaking&quot. Most likely God conversed with other prophets I'm unaware of. But certainly Muhammad was not one of them.

4251

http//www.everyayah.com/data/images_png/42_51.png

Muhammad was given words by a messenger God sent. Not talking from behind a veil.

Peace

runninglikezebras

To me the concept of people who claim God talks to them directly is completely strange. When I see others claim such things, most of the time I think it's either pretentiousness or a mental disorder.

Unless of course they prove themselves to be messengers from God. I consider Muhammad to be a messenger from God.

Peace

drfazl

Look up the verses in Quran that describe how God talks to Musa, asking him what his staff is for. Musa literally hears God voice, he can hear every word of this question in a verbal format. He does not see God, though he can hear every word God is saying. Quran describes this method of communication as 'from behind a veil'. It is one of three methods how God communicates with human beings. In those verses I'm referring to, Musa replies to God. God can hear Musa and replies to him.

42.51
It is not for any human being that Allah should speak to him except through Wahi or from behind a partition or that He sends a messenger to reveal, by His permission, what He wills. Indeed, He is Most High and Wise.

runninglikezebras, tell me after reading the following, what means of literal, physical nature that Allah communicates with any man on the earth, except your own take that which you believe. When Musa cannot see physical God, do you imagine for Him a physical mouth, eyes and things like that? You aught to cite reference from Quran to prove that Allah speaks literally too. Please read the only 3 ways by which Allah communicates with the humans.

It is not for any human being that Allah should speak to him except -
Musa was a human being like the rest of every human being

There are 3 ways Allah does speak to every human being

Allah should speak to him except through Wahi as direct inspiration from Allah -
Allah should speak to every prophet i.e., human beings through Wahi

Or,

That Allah should speak to them from behind a veil -
Allah speaks to every human being through the Messengers from Malayika, who are veiled to man's physical eyes.

Or,

That He should send a human messenger who reveals the words of Allah

Apart from the 3 ways I have cited, kindly cite from your side the ayats that say Allah speaks to the ears of the human beings through the words and syllables uttered through the mouth.

Compare this to the verses mentioning Muhammad. It is not a dialogue with God in any understanding. Muhammad was asked to obey the messenger (angel) and submit. Outside these instructions he received from the angel/messenger, Quran tells us Muhammad erred and was criticized for it. If you claim he was enlightened, how would you explain him erring and being criticized for it? I think you are still somewhat idolizing Muhammad if you think there is evidence inside Quran of him being enlightened.

Are you ignorantly or wrongly insinuating Muhammad when Muhammad is not mentioned by name in any of the ayats you have suggested?

Man_of_Faith

Yes,

And I wrote that AM has a meaning as a nation of people because they believe in the same derived customs and culture. This is because AM means "are thereof" as a collective. The same reason why it is referring to mother in some instances.

In the highlighted passage it refers to "be of the messenger prophet" as in mode of being and as a collective who follow him.

Salaam

runninglikezebras

Yes,

And I wrote that AM has a meaning as a nation of people because they believe in the same derived customs and culture. This is because AM means "are thereof" as a collective. The same reason why it is referring to mother in some instances.

In the highlighted passage it refers to "be of the messenger prophet" as in mode of being and as a collective who follow him.

Salaam

Well no, it means the gentile prophet obviously. Just look at the many occurences where it is used as community/nation/people. Look at how Quran describes the jews in contrast. Ummi is, just like in OT, people in contrast to Gods chosen people, the israelites.

Peace

runninglikezebras

42.51
It is not for any human being that Allah should speak to him except through Wahi or from behind a partition or that He sends a messenger to reveal, by His permission, what He wills. Indeed, He is Most High and Wise.

runninglikezebras, tell me after reading the following, what means of literal, physical nature that Allah communicates with any man on the earth, except your own take that which you believe. When Musa cannot see physical God, do you imagine for Him a physical mouth, eyes and things like that? You aught to cite reference from Quran to prove that Allah speaks literally too. Please read the only 3 ways by which Allah communicates with the humans.

It is not for any human being that Allah should speak to him except -
Musa was a human being like the rest of every human being

There are 3 ways Allah does speak to every human being

Allah should speak to him except through Wahi as direct inspiration from Allah -
Allah should speak to every prophet i.e., human beings through Wahi

Wrong conclusion to say this was possible with every prophet. If so why were messengers/angels used?

Or,

That Allah should speak to them from behind a veil -
Allah speaks to every human being through the Messengers from Malayika, who are veiled to man's physical eyes.

Wrong understanding. This means literally speaking (like to Musa).

Or,

That He should send a human messenger who reveals the words of Allah

You are confused brother. This category involves a malaika messenger. It's not referring to human messengers.

Apart from the 3 ways I have cited, kindly cite from your side the ayats that say Allah speaks to the ears of the human beings through the words and syllables uttered through the mouth.

(20.16). What is that in your right hand, O Moses? (20.17)? He said ?This is my staff; I recline on it, I beat down with it tree leaves for my sheep, and I use it for other things? (20.1. He said ?Throw it down, O Moses!?

Are you ignorantly or wrongly insinuating Muhammad when Muhammad is not mentioned by name in any of the ayats you have suggested?

Brother, learn to read. Also, find me one verse that is similar to 20.16-18 involving Muhammad. Find me one verse in which God speaks to Muhammad without using an angel/messenger. Brother, those verses don't exist. You can't substantiate what you are trying to project. God speaking to Muhammad is nowhere in Quran. It's time you face this truth.

ps its kind of funny you cite the exact same verse I gave you earlier, and you start distorting it

Peace

Man_of_Faith

The Rabb does not normally speak to humans yes, but that does not mean The Rabb is not present and with a person. The Rabb does not have to speak to humans because the ascended are obedient and treading the image.

And the one who can emulate ALLAH is in ALLAH.

And there must be interpretation problems because GOD is seen talking to Abraham in parts of Quran because the 'qul' word is being used. And not only there but 'qul' is used other times as well.

Salaam

hicham9

SLM@ MOF!

Where did ALLH ever teach us to emulate Him* !?

no gender intended.

drfazl

Wrong conclusion to say this was possible with every prophet. If so why were messengers/angels used?

Wrong understanding. This means literally speaking (like to Musa).

You are confused brother. This category involves a malaika messenger. It's not referring to human messengers

Who is right and who is wrong is known only to Allah; and only Allah Knows the real meanings of His ayats 3/7; so what is expected of us is to listen the speeches carefully and intently and choose the best of them all 39/18 - such are knowledgeable ones and it is them Allah conducts in righteousness. If you abide and honour these ayats then you have not read Quran to learn from Allah, but to argue.

Brother, learn to read.

The other way is the best to satisfy Allah and to help Allah teach you directly through wahi.

(20.16). What is that in your right hand, O Moses? (20.17)? He said ?This is my staff; I recline on it, I beat down with it tree leaves for my sheep, and I use it for other things? (20.1. He said ?Throw it down, O Moses!?

If Musa was one to one with Allah in person, and all alone, and in total seclusion from the rest of the population, then the conversation would have been like this (20.16). What is that in your right hand?" ?This is my staff; I recline on it, I beat down with it tree leaves for my sheep, and I use it for other things? (20.1. He said ?Throw it down!". Calling by Name, "O Musa!" is to draw Musa's attention to the Wahi of Allah as and when He intends to convey the message, while he is in other activities. There is a lot to read to learn here; this is not possible until your line of approach is "learn to read".

Also, find me one verse that is similar to 20.16-18 involving Muhammad. Find me one verse in which God speaks to Muhammad without using an angel/messenger. Brother, those verses don't exist. You can't substantiate what you are trying to project. God speaking to Muhammad is nowhere in Quran. It's time you face this truth.

ps its kind of funny you cite the exact same verse I gave you earlier, and you start distorting it

I will answer to you when your occupancy and mood is changed to read to learn

And I want to know you if you read and re-read to learn from the ayat cited below"

2.253 Of those messengers, some of whom We have caused to excel others, and of whom there are some unto whom Allah has spoken to, while some of them He exalted in degree...

Please say to me who are all those messengers Allah had directly talked to...

drfazl

Bear not the burden, by Allah

7.189
And He created you from the Same Soul; and from it He created its companion for solace - when one sought the comfort of another@, they began to bear the burden; and when the burden became unbearable, they both turned to their God and said, ?If you deliver us by Your Mercy, we will be grateful.?

@ Allah created mankind by breathing His Ruh, into the soul; and He created companions for the soul, similarly bearing His Ruh, its function being the Guidance and the Benevolence in Truth, all through one?s life. When they increased in their comforts and pleasures in the companionship they forgot the Benevolence of the Most Benevolent and thus did fail in His remembrance and show of gratitude 43/36; so shaitan followed them and led them astray making them both bear the burden of the evils that their own hands had worked. When they both realized it is beyond their ability to bear the increasing burden any further, they both turned to their God and said, ?If You deliver us of the burden by Your Mercy, we will both be grateful unto You.? And Allah accepted their call and delivered them from their misfortunes; but then they became forgetful and fell again - this time, committing the worst crime i.e., they set up partners unto Allah.

drfazl

8.12 Your God inspired the angels@ saying, ?Verily I am with you; so strengthen those who believe; I will cast terror in the hearts of those who disbelieve; you shall smite at their necks and smite off their fingers.?

@ In a predominantly disbelieving wicked population around the globe from every denomination of all sects and religions such as Islam, Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Budhism etc., if a believer in One God, in His Judgment, in His Angels, in His Book and in His Prophets 2/177, 285 - is surviving amidst the thick of the disbelieving populace, it is because of the God send angels to strengthen his soul, mind, heart and feet. As believers, the third very important asset and assertion to them from God is the support and reinforcement sent through His angels 41/30, 31. And after our belief in Allah and in His Decree, we shall strive to make the malayikas - the angels, friends to us by His Leave. Believing in the Book, the Quran comes as the 4th proviso and the 5th and the last is the belief in the Prophets who stood as perfect models to all the previous 4 provisions Allah has made mandatory upon a believer. But the tragedy lies in a common islamic believer in that he says he believes in Allah and the Prophet, throwing the mandatory other three provisions away ignorantly. The order of Allah is lost for any one who says, ?I believe in Allah and in His Prophet.? So say from now onwards as Kalima, the Pledge I believe in Allah;; I believe in His Last Day; I believe in His Malayika, the Angels; I believe in the Book; and I believe in the Prophets who we shall believe are not to be considered dead but are living models of the Book, living with us as immortals. Belief in this immortal presence of all the prophets with each of us is possible only if we believe and make the angels as friends and as protectors, by Allah?s permission.

drfazl

8.13 This is because they did do injustice to Allah and His messenger; whoever does injustice to Allah and His messenger surely Allah is severe in punishing.

To safeguard us from this wrath of Allah it is time we believed in Him, in His Last Day, in His Angels and in His Book before we say we believe in the Prophets of Allah.

drfazl

8.14 It will be said, ?Taste this! Surely there is punishment of fire, for the disbelievers.?

This torment of fire is eternal for there is no death for them; and their skins will be constantly renewed in such swiftness even as it is burnt that we will never see it getting burnt at all but they will fully suffer the burning of fire in its totality; we see such suffering in millions of people with diabetes who have burning feet and legs; but they do not see any burning of the skin.

drfazl

8.34 But why should Allah not punish them? They trespass and bar the people in their ?righteous houses @?, while they are not its custodians; but for the righteous shall be its guardians; yet most of them understand not.

@ Each one has his God-given house i.e, The God's House; and God expects one and all to be pious and be grateful to Him for the same, so that Allah makes their houses Sacred; and the households would guard The House as the ?gift of God? keeping them close to their hearts, as Sacred-mosques; no affliction nor adversity would ever touch its people. Its people - wherever they go forth from it, their minds will all the time be circumventing (tawaf) The House and the household with full of piety and heartfelt prayers, wishing their households to stay pure only for Allah.

drfazl

8.75Who are your real relations?

8.75 And following this, those who believed and emigrated and strove in the path of Allah in the just war with you, they too are of you; and by Allah?s decree, they are your lawful kindred; one is very closely related to another; Allah is surely cognizant of all things.

Sahih International And those who believed after and emigrated and fought with you - they are of you. But those of relationship are more entitled in the decree of Allah. Indeed, Allah is Knowing of all things.

DrGm

8.75Who are your real relations?

8.75 And following this, those who believed and emigrated and strove in the path of Allah in the just war with you, they too are of you; and by Allah?s decree, they are your lawful kindred; one is very closely related to another; Allah is surely cognizant of all things.

Sahih International And those who believed after and emigrated and fought with you - they are of you. But those of relationship are more entitled in the decree of Allah. Indeed, Allah is Knowing of all things.

peace,

Allah's decree for the believers in Him, the Righteous; He talks about the real relations with Him - He brings His relations together as close relations wherever they are..

(2.148 - And for each one is His direction, towards which he turns; and race to it for good; wherever that you will be, Allah will bring you all together. Indeed Allah has power over all things.)

peace

dr_rks

Husband-wife relation
Parent-children relation
Brothers and sisters relation
And other immediate and distant relations......Money and material are the base for all these relationships. If we dont satisfy other's expectation, then the relationship breaks away. Certainly everyone will realise this truth in their life. Thats why allah says this(blood relation) is not true relation. ---Those who follow allah and messenger's guidance,and other true believers,they are our true relations--- .

hicham9

Well said @dr.rks!

I expect no less of an unsealed mind.

SLM

drfazl

The Law of The Land9.5

9.5 When the sacred months@ end - sever the criminals on the spot; and seize them; and surround them; and keep vigil over their hideouts. But whoever repents and amends in the path of God while purifying them through spending, then allow them freedom; surely Allah is Ever Forgiving, Most Merciful.

@ Sacred months are the amnesty period given to the dreaded criminals to lay down their arms and surrender to the Law; they are rebellious defy, deny and reject the Law of Land; they cause corruption in the land and create fear amidst the people who love peaceful living,. These are the disobeying unbelievers - the criminals amidst the well-mannered, peace-loving people of a country - they are to be severed or cut off from the society through arrest and removed to confinement. Such dreaded criminals who elude the law causing terror in the land shall even be shot down in encounter at their very sight. The constitution of the Land shall also bear in mind that Forgiveness and Mercy shall be of paramount consciousness while framing the Law. Such Sacredness must be the backbone of The Constitution. But if the disbelievers become challengers to the Sacred Constitution itself, and refuse to surrender, despite the offer of amnesty, then, when the offer of their sacred period is over shoot at sight!

drfazl

Four Months or Four Qualities

9.36 By Allah?s word, from the time the skies and the earth were created the months are twelve; in them four is Sacred@- and this is the straight path. Therefore in those months wrong not yourselves; and as the wrongful devise against you all, you too stand firm against them all; verily, Allah is with those who are God fearing.

@ The four sacred are Keeping up Faith in Allah and the Last Day; Forgiving people; showing them Guidance; and seeking Patience from Allah. This in essence is Believing in Allah and doing Good, so that we reach paradises in the hereafter, through blissful lives in this world. This is the straight path of Allah. If you miss out on these Four, then you have wronged yourselves.