Where and what is the house? and why was it made?
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Salaam Anwar,
If you check Muhammad Ali's translation, here's the footnoteOthers say it is from a root meaning the breaking of the neck, and the name is given to it because whenever a tyrant forced his way to it, his neck was broken (Rz).
As for it being dissimilar to BKY, I'd have to disagree, because I reject the trilateral root concept. I think all similarities (and by that dissimilarities) are purposeful in al-quraan.
That's also why I'd never say 'bi' and 'fi' are interchangable.
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SaLaM SM
This sounds a far more logic to me than to travel around the earth to visit a place there they commit idolworshipping.
See that is the thing, God has already commanded us to travel to the Sacred House / Shrine becoz WE as MANKIND owe him that. Not for idolworshipping. God has not commanded us to worship the Sacred House. No where in the Quran will you find that.
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Salaam sweet Br Jaxal,
He He you never give up on this do you!?
Remember God don't need anything from us, it is we who need God.
Peace
Sis Majidah -
Salaam Jaxal,
See that is the thing, God has already commanded us to travel to the Sacred House / Shrine becoz WE as MANKIND owe him that. Not for idolworshipping. God has not commanded us to worship the Sacred House. No where in the Quran will you find that.
He has commanded the hajj to the bait, yes. But where is the bait ? It's definitely not the cube in the desert, is it?
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All evidence ? WHERE is this all evidence please ?
Allah made the house to be a resort for mankind and a safe place (2/125). Your place in mecca has nothing to do with this. It doesn't even allow mankind is, to say nothing about being a resort or a safe place.
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As far as i know, only non-muslims are not allowed. Why would a kufar be allowed near the Sacred House / Shrine?
The Quran allows HUMANKIND to enter, not only with the muslim label. This is who the saudis allow in there. Lets face facts, the Saudis aren't guarding God's house at all.
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SaLaM mquran
i think those who believe is the phrase here. And you are right, i agree with you, the saudis arent doing a good job. But if someone dont beleive in Allah, why should he be allowed in there? I see no reason for their presence in the vacinity of the Sacred House / Shrine.
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i think those who believe is the phrase here. And you are right, i agree with you, the saudis arent doing a good job. But if someone dont beleive in Allah, why should he be allowed in there? I see no reason for their presence in the vacinity of the Sacred House / Shrine.
'Nobody is asking you to see reason for thier presence , im sorry to say. All im asking is for you to open the book which you claim to your criteria.
'Those who believe'is nowhere to be found in 2/125. It will then tell you that 'the house' is a resort for MANKIND. Anyone can go there unless they break the laws. Jaxal, may i ask you to OPEN THE QURAN FOR YOURSELF. Dare to read it, even if it goes against your belief system. -
On the contrary, I found in it every belief i have right now . It is you, my brother, who is going against it
Excellent. What you need to do is then, be happy and not discuss it at all because when you discuss something of this nature, for some really wierd reason, people start asking you for evidence. You tell people nonsense like 'the quran teaches democracy' and 'the quran teaches hajj in mecca' WITHOUT EVER QUOTING A SINGLE PIECE OF EVIDENCE. No problem there because I'm done speaking without evidence. Thank you and peace.
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Salaam all,
Jaxal,
yes i understand when you say that masjid al haram is in saudi arabia for you. That's also what i accepted for a long time - just because it's so universally accepted in the muslim world that you project what you believe to be true in the reading.
But think about the christians - not many would dare think twice about the sonship of Issa...and they will find all kind of evidence in the bible.
But it's their surrounding that guides them. One has to go above. First thing is to understand that there is just one god and just one message valid for all of humanity. Even someone who has never even heard of islam can be a muslim at heart, reach out and work on masjid al haram - this place inside yourself on which you have to work on in order to advance in life.
Don't ask me to cite verses, they are all above here. But it's they way you read them that explains the different understanding. Concerning me, it took me nearly 20 years to get to this understanding and the process never ends.
Peace, LK
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Salaam Sis Elke,
Very well said, directly from your heart
Peace
Sis Majidah -
SaLaM Elke and mquran
Elke the thing is, during this discussion, i have come to find out that the best argument against the Kabbah is that this is all a conspiracy. I swear this is the best argument. ITs either that, or its all lies invented by the scholors.
But elke, imagine if you lived in your country for generations, and your great grandfather saw the name change and then he passed that knowledge to your dad, who passed that knowledge to YOU, will it be fair to say that all you are doing is following the lies of the scholors?
This is the problem. The argument so far against the Kabbah is that how can God ask us to worship the a stone? well, God DIDNT. God just said, we owe him a pilgrimage. Simple as that. progod gave me an article, and in that article, the author says, its all a conspiracy. People made the Kabbah to validate a verse from God. Then they carved foot prints LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL THIS IS HILLARIOUS!!.
So elke, i have yet to see a single argument againt the Kabbah which is not
a] its all a consipracy
b] its the inovation of the scholorsAnd mquran ihave posted my evidence from the Quran. You just choose to ignore it. Dont blame me for that.
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And mquran ihave posted my evidence from the Quran. You just choose to ignore it. Dont blame me for that.
Please indulge me by at least pointing out where, Jaxal.
Allow me to summarise my point to you.
I acknowledge we need to make the hajj of the house. Im just telling you, at this point in time, the shrine in mecca DOESN'T FIT 'the house' description. Its as simple as that.