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General Issues / Questions

This area deals with any general questions/issues regarding God / Islam / Quran not covered under other headings.

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  • Do you still feel a sense of community or unity with Sunni Muslims

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    By returning to God, I meant returning to the state of infinity, to the state of unity, as that is what God is, that is what an infinity is, that is what unity is. God IS. Unity with everything including "Sunnis Muslims" or any other label / identities / conception that one might come up with. All conception, identities and thus separation are virtual / illusion in nature.
  • Lost

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    Thank you everyone for your input. Please dont start any arguments in the comment. It makes me more anxious. While I appreciate every response, please dont share anything that will make me question my faith more. If I wanted to have a debate about Quran i would have gone to any atheist site. When atheists talk about Quran, it is as described in 37 It is He who has sent down to you the Book; in it are verses precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is deviation, they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation. And no one knows its interpretation except Allah. But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding. A good website from former atheist https//www.answeringislamicskeptics.com/why-is-the-quran-vague.html I can't believe I am having an existential crisis at the age of 20. I didn't imagine my life like this. I never imagine I would become one of those people who would struggle with their faith. Each day passes I feel like I am getting closer to the day I would have no faith left. This has taken such a toll on my life. I have started having nightmares about it. In my dream I see myself becoming faithless and not being sad about it. I see myself feeling freed. But it fills me with dread. I dont want to be faithless and happy. I dont want to not care about my faith. I dont want to be not bothered about having no faith. I cannot read Quran now. Do you have any book recommendation that covers about the spiritual stuff and connection with God? I know sufis are very into that, any sufi book recommendation. I am not worried about religion. I am worried about my faith in God. I dont care if you recommend any book by non muslims. I just want to be trust God back. Thank you Contrary to what majority believe ...Quran is actually "anti religion". “And this is your nation, one nation, and I am your Lord so be aware.” But the affair was disputed between them into segments. Every group happy with what it had. So leave them in their error until a time. So set your face to the system of monotheism. It is the inclination that God has nurtured the people on. There is no changing in the creation of God. Such is the pure system, but most of the people do not know. Turn to Him, and be aware of Him, and hold the Connection, and do not be of the polytheists. From those who have divided their system and become "religion", each group is happy with what it has. And those who are divided into "religion" is polytheist in the sight of God.
  • Salat

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    Salaam, here is the "ritual part" of my Salat <commitment>. To read the Quran at the appointed schedule, 4103 ..Indeed, the commitment for the believers is a Book that is scheduled. you can find my understanding in my old post in here, Couldn't agree more, Taro Hiroshi. IMHO, salaat is uphold God's reminder (dhikr). 2014 "I am God, there is no god except Me, so serve Me and uphold commitment (wa aqimisalaata) for My reminder God's reminder for mukmin is Quran. So, basically following God's rule in Quran is a form of salaat. I agree with you regarding Quran speaks about every thing we need to know regarding salaat. To uphold commitment (salaat) for God's reminder (Quran), first we need to start reading. 4103 ..Indeed, the commitment for the believers is a Book that is scheduled. First thing about salaat is we are commanded to read the Quran on daily basis, scheduled. You can do it while you're standing, or sitting, or on your sides. So I set my personal alarm like this http//s19.postimg.org/d04hn53gf/quranal.jpg based on 11114 And uphold the commitment at two ends of the day, and the near side of the night. The good deeds take away the bad. This is a reminder to those who remember. 1778 Uphold the commitment at the rubbing of the sun, until the darkening of the night; and the Qur'an at dawn-the Qur'an at dawn is witnessed "Quranal fajri" means reading at the dawn and "bacaan petang" means reading at the dusk. and additional reading at night 1779 And from the night, as an addition, you shall reflect upon it for yourself, perhaps your Lord would grant you a station that is praiseworthy. this additional reading has been explained in detail in following verses 7320 Your Lord knows that you rise a little less than two thirds of the night, and half of it, and one third of it; and a group of those who are with you. And God measures the night and the day. He knows that you will not be able to keep-up, so He pardons you. So read what is made easy of the Quran. He knows that there will be sick among you, and others that go forth in the land seeking from the bounty of God, and others who are fighting in the cause of God, so read what you can of it.. Just read as much as you can for additional reading. Ok, so now uphold commitment (aqimusalaa) to kitabun mawqutan (a Book that is scheduled) is already clear to me. What's next? Uphold commitment for the things I've already know from kitab. For example Being honest and trustworthy in business/trading Salatil min Yaumil Jumuah explain so much about this.. before go to the verses I would like to share my understanding about yaumil jumuah Yaumil Jumuah/Gathering Day (629) = Yawmil Jam'i/Gathering Day (649) = Yaumul Taghabuni/Day of mutual gain and loss (in the context of trading) (649) = Yaumil Qiyamati/the Day of assembly (4526) = Yaumun la bay'un/ No trading day (2254). So the Yaumil Jumuah (gathering day) must be understood that it is not Friday or the sixth day in a week, but it's the day which hasn't come yet, and will be coming someday and also known as the day of ressurection. Ok so let see, 629 yāayyuhā alladhīnaāmanū idhā nūdiya lilssalati min yawmil-jumuati fa-is'aw ilā dhik'ri l-lahi wadharū l-bay'a dhālikum khayrun lakum in kuntum ta'lamūna 629 O you who believe, when the call is made for the commitment of the day of gathering, then you shall hasten towards the remembrance of God, and cease all trading. This is better for you, if only you knew. Please be aware that the verse has used the word min before the yaumil jumuah to prevent the meaning "at the day". So it should be "of the day". There are three things in the verse Calling the commitment of the yaumil jumuah Get back to the dhikr'i (N) or God's reminder Cease all trading So context here is about business/trading. How to perform business/trading according to the dhikri (God's reminder/Al Quran). As you can see in 629 and 649, that Yawmil Jumuah in 629 has the same word with the Yawmil Jam'i in 649. And in 649 you can find that Yawmil Jam'i also known as Yawmun Taghabuni, or The Day mutual gain or loss or cheat in business/trading, the same thing you can find in 2254, Yaumun la bay'un. 649 The Day when He will gather you; the Day of Gathering; that is the Day of mutual gain and loss. And whoever believes in God and does good works, He will forgive his sins, and will admit him into estates with rivers flowing beneath them, abiding therein eternally. Such is the great triumph. What we can find that Salaa in 629 means commitment to prepare ourselves before the day of gathering (also known as no trading day) comes. How to perform business/trading according to Quran. Why we need to cease the trading then? It caused by one of basic principles of business/trading is not easy to understand for some people as shown in the following verse 2275 Those who consume usury (riba) do not rise except as one being influenced by the touch of the devil. That is because they have said "Trade is the same as usury (riba)." While God has made trade lawful, and He has made usury unlawful. Whoever has received understanding from His Lord and ceases, then he will be forgiven for what was before this and his case will be with God. But whoever returns, then they are the people of the Fire, in it they will abide. So the believer must stop for a while to understand how the trading works, how the trading different than usury. And if the commitment has been made or the concept has been fully understood, the believer can continue to the business. 6210 Then, once the commitment is completed, you shall disperse through the land and seek the provisions of God, and remember God frequently that you may succeed. Others basic principles of trading could be found in 2188, 2282, 1735, and 2437. Adhere to the agreement 2177 ...and those who keep their pledges when they make a pledge.. When you do a business, just keep adhere to your agreement. That's a salaat (commitment). Avoid to have a business deal with your partners while you get drunk, unless you know what you're saying. 443 O you who believe, do not come near the commitment while you are intoxicated, until you know what you are saying. this is to avoid you have promised on something that you can't remember or fulfill. The reason behind this is clear 591 The devil only wants to cause strife between you through intoxicants (khamr) and gambling, and to repel you away from remembering God and from the commitment. Will you be deterred? One more example regarding the will 5106 O you who believe, witnessing shall be done if death is approaching one of you and a will is being made-by two who are equitable amongst you. Or, by two man other than you if you have gone forth in the land and death is approaching. If you have doubt regarding them, then you will hold them after making the commitment, and let them swear by God "We will not purchase with it any price, even if it was from a near relative, and we will not conceal the testimony of God, else we are of the sinners. Imagine when you are travelling to other countries, let say Peru, South America. And something serious happen, the death is approaching. You are trying to make a will for your families and others, but you cannot find "people among you" means in the same creed. There is a lawyer and his associates willing to help but they are both Christians. You just simply ask them to uphold commitment (salaat) and let them swear by the God. This is to uphold the commitment to God's reminder. Basic concept of salaat is universal. Means that it will be easily understood by the people regardless their creed. So my conclusions If you're study quran at the dawn, and dusk until night, you upholding salaat If you avoid riba in business, being honest and trustworthy in trading, you upholding salaat If you managed to reject bribery, you upholding salaat If you have power and stay away from corruption, you upholding salaat If you keep your pledge while making a pledge, you upholding salaat If you managed to control the passions of lust, avoid cheating on your marriage, you upholding salaat If you wish to feed the poor and the orphans, you upholding salaat If you only use the original software, not making a piracy, only purchase music/videos from the official store, you upholding salaat and so on so forth There's a lot of explanation in Quran regarding salaat depends on its context, and how to uphold it. All we need to do is study it based on prescribed schedule. This is the goal of salaat 2945 Recite what is inspired to you of the Book and uphold the commitment, for the commitment prohibits immorality and vice; but certainly the reminder of God is the greatest. God knows everything you do. Only your commitment will prohibits immorality and evil deeds. Salaam Peace
  • Friendship

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    We all have our own "space",like we have our home. When you let someone into your space and they let you into theirs you are friends. I welcome anyone to be my friend if they choose to. Nobody can be forced to friendship. Love GOD and love thy neighbor and see what happens. Do not close your space to those who knock on your space door. GOD bless. Peace.
  • Who's further away/ worse in the sight of God from these two groups

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    Both because atheists do follow satan since they reject God. They follow their desires and do whatever they want. 2543 Have you seen the one who takes as his god his own desire? Then would you be responsible for him?
  • Uh-huh the timeline is not matching

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    Hi again, I was reading Quran ( surah Mariam to be specific ) and I came across this verse " O sister of Aaron! Your father was not an indecent man, nor was your mother unchaste.” ( 1928 ) How can Aaron be Mary's brother?! So now according to Quran, Moses was Jesus's uncle ? Also, we have seen Injeel getting mentioned repeatedly in the Quran, what exactly is Injeel ? Is it gospel ? How can it be gospel when gospel wasn't even written by Jesus? If it's not gospel then what is it exactly ? There's something that is not adding up here. Peace everyone.... I am still concerned about Harun (brother of Musa) and Maryam being siblings.. In fact I deduced that Harun may not possibly be her brother... But not thoroughly convinced.. But while I was reading this verse in chapter 1906 Sahih International "Who will inherit me and inherit from the family of Jacob. And make him, my Lord, pleasing ." I feel Yakub the grandson of Ibrahim is father of Zakaria... If that is correct then Harun being the sister of Maryam is also possible.. In that case time period between Musa and Isa is not that much like history states.. What is your view... Addition... If not son at least Zakaria could be grandson of Yakub.. Not more than that...
  • Jinn

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    Abdun Nur - go away rotfl
  • If a person ask for evidence Islam is the truth, how would you respond

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    Peace So if a non-Muslim (or even a Muslim) asks why and how Islam is the truth and what evidence there is for it, how would you explain this? Peace everyone... 238 says it so simply that Guidance would come from the very inception.. God didn't neglect any community... Problem here is weight on Arabic word Islam... Islam is the truth because we are created and we are to surrender to the one who created us and everything... In a very simple way Islam is to surrender to the one who created us... So if the person asks why islam is true coz creation is true and the creator is true so Islam is true... There is no other Islam other than surrendering to the one who gave us life... There is no Islam if there is no creator... Manifestly tell whoever asks you that i believe that I am not on my own into this world but I am created by another so I surrender to the one who shaped me.. That is my Islam.. Is there any truth beyond that then ask him or her to bring the truth beyond Islam= surrender .. Books and etc is later.. first surrender that is Islam then look for truth and satisfaction and ways preferred by creator that we will find through His messages... If surrendering is not truth, what is truth? Ask the same person who asks you what is captioned.. Evidence is that let them live a life and let them find out whether they are created or evolved without any influence... If they find answer they can decide Islam is true or false.. That depends... Otherthan that even if you let them see the greatest of signs of God they won't believe.... First they should verify it is created.. Then find the creator...
  • Why you cannot doubt God's Existence

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    Peace Wakas.. I looked at your link. In principle I get what you are trying to say,however this statement is not correct,quote "First of all, to understand the discussion, you must have some basic knowledge of Islam, which I will provide below. The religion of Islam, is based upon its holy book – The Quran, which is written in Arabic (the chosen language of revelation). In much the same way as Christianity is based upon The Bible, and Judaism is based upon The Torah (Old Testament)." Qoran clearly states that "Islam" existed before all the holy books that you talked about arrived. i.e before Judaism,Christianity or Qoran. So the basis of Islam existed at least since Noah. Qoran clearly states that Noah, Abraham and some of the generations after them before Qoran had Islam as their Deen. Or at least one needs to define and clarify which "Islam" the statement is implying? GOD bless you. Peace.
  • Working in a Tobacco Company

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    What is legal is positive law, this means it is granted rights and imposed duties enforced through a monopoly on violence, the grant is made from a superior (master) upon an inferior (slave), all law is therefore slave law, what you posses is inherent power which is not granted by a superior but inherent based on reciprocation. The basis of inherent power is the reciprocal duty of care, this means it is incumbent upon you to treat all others as you yourself would wish to be treated, this same principle applies to all aspects of life, legislation is designed to allow what is against the reciprocal duty of care, and so we exist in a system that is based on the five forms of usury (riba). So is making poisons or weapons, or being a solider, or policy enforcer (police), or MP breaking that inherent duty of care, yes all these activities break at inherent duty.
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    Everyone of these places is dominated by a mafia, why are you blind to reality, Israel wealth is created from theft and riba, is that Islamic? You people are nuts!
  • Question about Quran 4:93

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    Peace the bosnian thinker. The context of 493 is believers fighting the munafekeen/Mushrikeen. The only reason /way of a believer to kill another believer deliberately is If a believer takes advantage of the war situation to kill another who they know is believer for their own personal motive /to gain something /jealousy/personal ......They may claim that he is a munafiq or accuse them of something ...etc In that case this believer has disobeyed and discarded GOD s instructions/command knowingly. Hence there will be no forgiveness. There is no other possibility,they are at war with the other side and are allowed to defend themselves.i.e killing "disbeliever" deliberately without a cause does not arise in that situation since the other ones are fighting them. Innocent "disbelievers will not be there fighting ! The believer who has committed such crime will know that the outcome is gehenna ,hence it is clarified in the verse. He has disbelieved after his belief and committed the crime knowingly and intentionally. Hope this clarifies the context for you, GOD bless you. Peace.
  • EXPOSING THE 3 SALAAT THEORY THE ULTIMATE REBUTTAL

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    Peace SniperX. You have the wrong information about the Salat I follow, quote "" You are just trying to leave loope holes for you to follow that distorted form of Salaat created by Freeminds or Monotheist Group. We are not supposed to follow your Hislam, we are supposed to follow Allah's prescribed Way Of Life which has been revealed in the Qur'aan." First. Free minds have many views about The Salat. Search and see the result of 0,2,3 or 5 daily Salat according to different views/understanding of members. So which one am I following? Second. I do not have a religion I want you or anyone else to follow, If you read my post properly I said this "here is no other right man made religion that we are led to believe will save us . It is pointless doing salat, zakat ,sawm ..etc if we do not "straighten up- and follow GOD s path of justice, fairness, ...and kill our "ego/arrogance " by acknowledging that GOD Alone is the sole authority/power and Lord of everything. Strive to LOVE GOD AND LOVE EACH OTHER. As for my take of the Salat - ,I connect to my creator 5 times daily. I am also trying my best to follow Qoran according to my understanding like you are with your understanding. I stick with my point that GOD S only religion according to Qoran is "iSLAM" -Submission and loyalty to GOD Alone- and that the straight path is the main priority for Muslims to GOD Islam to GOD is not the "Muslim religion that some claim or we have today". Islam is not defined as following all the qoran and its laws. Islam was the only DEEN accepted by GOD throughout the human history, is and will be. Islam existed way before Qoran and Mohammed. Islam to GOD is an invitation to all mankind to acknowledge and believe in the Creator with sincerity and honesty and accept GOD s guidance to become straight(follow the straight path). i.e an individual relationship/attitude to start the process of guidance from GOD. Islam to GOD is accepting The one GOD as authority . Religions are diverse and have different rules. Believers in Qoran may differ in rules than believers in bible or ... The only DEEN approved by God is "ISLAM." Ironically, those who have received the scripture are the ones who dispute this fact, despite the knowledge they have received, due to jealousy. For such rejectors of God's revelations, God is most strict in reckoning. إِنَّ الدّينَ عِندَ اللَّهِ الإِسلٰمُ وَمَا اختَلَفَ الَّذينَ أوتُوا الكِتٰبَ إِلّا مِن بَعدِ ما جاءَهُمُ العِلمُ بَغيًا بَينَهُم وَمَن يَكفُر بِـٔايٰتِ اللَّهِ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ سَريعُ الحِسابِ If they argue with you, then say, "I have simply ASLAMTU- submitted myself to God; I and those who follow me." You shall proclaim to those who received the scripture, as well as those who did not, "Would you submit?" If they submit, then they have been guided, but if they turn away, your sole mission is to deliver this message. God is Seer of all people. فَإِن حاجّوكَ فَقُل أَسلَمتُ وَجهِىَ لِلَّهِ وَمَنِ اتَّبَعَنِ وَقُل لِلَّذينَ أوتُوا الكِتٰبَ وَالأُمِّيّـۧنَ ءَأَسلَمتُم فَإِن أَسلَموا فَقَدِ اهتَدَوا وَإِن تَوَلَّوا فَإِنَّما عَلَيكَ البَلٰغُ وَاللَّهُ بَصيرٌ بِالعِبادِ For my part , I want to finish with respect and friendship towards you brother and all readers of this thread and ask the following,not to expect an answer ,but for reflection to all If Islam is defined as following Mohammed and the rules of his message ,which I do not find that in Qoran, then this needs to be reconciled. 1- GOD makes it clear in Qoran that whoever accept ANY OTHER DEEN apart from ISLAm , will be with the losers. 2- Yet iinforms us as follows Surely, those who believe, those who are Jewish, the converts, and the Christians; any of them who (1) believe in God and (2) believe in the Last Day, and (3) lead a righteous life, have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve. إِنَّ الَّذينَ ءامَنوا وَالَّذينَ هادوا وَالصّٰبِـٔونَ وَالنَّصٰرىٰ مَن ءامَنَ بِاللَّهِ وَاليَومِ الـٔاخِرِ وَعَمِلَ صٰلِحًا فَلا خَوفٌ عَلَيهِم وَلا هُم يَحزَنونَ We need to identify Deen meanings from the context of Qoran to eliminate issues that faulty interpretations bring like contradictions. For me Deen can mean many things,system,millat Sharia, laws,...tec. GOD may have established a social Deen with Mohammed but added that he also approved the DEEN Islam like it was done by previous messengers throughout the human history. Submitting to GOD and following the straight path is the most important priority. If one follows Qoran ,then the Salat ,sawm...etc are a great help towards developing the soul. Hope you understand my point. GOD bless you. Peace.
  • Hur Ain

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    Application of the verses seem to show a reality kept mostly secret. Distortion apparently is intentional in every religion because they fear misuse of the knowledge. I don't know what garden truly means anymore. But yes, tiny spirit guides seem to exist. Then there are changeable large eyes within eyes. I still don't know their purpose.
  • Chapter 4:3

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    Do not consume their money, but if they are kind of mentally retarded ... 45 And do not give the foolish ones <has limited understanding> ... So now, how do we deal with the female orphan that already reach the age of the marriage but they are kind of mentally retarded? Most likely nobody else want to marry them. This is a dilemma situation. We cannot continue to be caretakers of female orphans who have become adult women and we have to hand over their assets to them. But on the one hand we are also worried about giving away their property because of their mental condition. ... 4127 They ask you for divine instruction concerning women... The only reason you're not give them their money is because they are mentally retarded or has limited understanding. So the solution here is to marry them, peace, general statement applies to either gender being able to manage money. 213 ... الا unquestionably انهم indeed they هم themselves السفها the foolish ولكن and however لا not ىعلمون knowing 45 ولا and not توتوا give السفها the foolish امولكم wealth yours التى the one جعل made الله the god لكم for you قىما provision of وارزقوهم and provisions ye them (masc. pl. boys, girls, their mothers) فىها with it واكسوهم and clothe ye them وقولوا and speak ye of لهم for them قولا speech of معروفا respectable of 4127 وىستفتونك and decision seeking they your فى in النسا the womenfolk قل say الله the god ىفتىكم giveth ruling you فىهن in them وما and what ىتلى recited is علىكم upon you فى in الكتب the book فى in ىتمى yatama/bereaved النسا l-nisai/the womenfolk التى the ones لا not توتونهن thou gives them ما what كتب written لهن for them (i.e. their inheritance) وترغبون and thou hoping ان that تنكحوهن thou marry ye them (when reached age of marriage) والمستضعفىن and those vulnerable they من of الولدن the youngsters (after their inheritance too) ...
  • Are most people good

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    Salam! Most human beings are EVIL by nature because Allah created us this way. وَآتَاكُم مِّن كُلِّ مَا سَأَلْتُمُوهُ ۚ وَإِن تَعُدُّوا نِعْمَتَ اللَّهِ لَا تُحْصُوهَا ۗ إِنَّ الْإِنسَانَ لَظَلُومٌ كَفَّارٌ إِنَّا عَرَضْنَا الْأَمَانَةَ عَلَى السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَالْجِبَالِ فَأَبَيْنَ أَن يَحْمِلْنَهَا وَأَشْفَقْنَ مِنْهَا وَحَمَلَهَا الْإِنسَانُ ۖ إِنَّهُ كَانَ ظَلُومًا جَهُولًا خَلَقَ الْإِنسَانَ مِن نُّطْفَةٍ فَإِذَا هُوَ خَصِيمٌ مُّبِينٌ أَوَلَمْ يَرَ الْإِنسَانُ أَنَّا خَلَقْنَاهُ مِن نُّطْفَةٍ فَإِذَا هُوَ خَصِيمٌ مُّبِينٌ وَيَدْعُ الْإِنسَانُ بِالشَّرِّ دُعَاءَهُ بِالْخَيْرِ ۖ وَكَانَ الْإِنسَانُ عَجُولًا وَلَئِنْ أَذَقْنَا الْإِنسَانَ مِنَّا رَحْمَةً ثُمَّ نَزَعْنَاهَا مِنْهُ إِنَّهُ لَيَئُوسٌ كَفُورٌ وَإِذَا مَسَّكُمُ الضُّرُّ فِي الْبَحْرِ ضَلَّ مَن تَدْعُونَ إِلَّا إِيَّاهُ ۖ فَلَمَّا نَجَّاكُمْ إِلَى الْبَرِّ أَعْرَضْتُمْ ۚ وَكَانَ الْإِنسَانُ كَفُورًا وَلَقَدْ صَرَّفْنَا فِي هَٰذَا الْقُرْآنِ لِلنَّاسِ مِن كُلِّ مَثَلٍ ۚ وَكَانَ الْإِنسَانُ أَكْثَرَ شَيْءٍ جَدَلًا There are many ayahs describing the inner nature of human beings, that is, الانسان but most people deny it. Only a few chosen people are among مخلصین. Peace!
  • Animal suffering

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    Peace, Allah says it's lawful to eat meat, there is no intended torture in halal slaughter, maybe some people think meat eating is forbidden but Allah says otherwise. peace Salam brother hawk! Pls give reference, where Allah says 'eat MEAT' Thanks & peace!
  • Mufti Menk

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    Promotes the light side of Islam with positive vibes but ultimately a hyprocrite. Joel Osteen type, who use to appease me during my younger years Joel. Very shrewd and wolves in sheep clothing, tapped into the modern era of positive engergy attraction to reach world scale audience-ship. They know what there doing
  • The kingdom of love,freedom and happiness.

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    I am all for each to lead themselves and follow the straight path. GOD bless you all. Peace.
  • Why does the Qur'an say...

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    How can you be so sure it's specific to the past? peace, see context obviously past event misspelling of 583 واذا wa-idha/and when of (alif added) 211 واذا wa-idha/and when of (time adverb i.e. present/future episode/event) قىل stated لهم to them لا not تفسدوا thou corrupt ye of فى in الارض the land قالوا said they of انما solely نحن we مصلحون who conciliators being 230 واذ wa-idh/and when (time adverb i.e. past separate episode/event) قال said ربك lord your للملىكه to the controllers (angels) … 583 واذا wa-idha/and when of (see qaf 47 ms.or.fol.4313 manuscript trailing alif added years later should be واذ wa-idh/and when i.e. past event likewise evident from context) سمعوا hear they of ما what انزل descends الى to الرسول the messenger ترى thou see اعىنهم eyes theirs تفىض overflowing من from الدمع the tears مما from what عرفوا recognize/knew they of من from الحق the truth ىقولون sayeth being ربنا lord ours امنا believe we of فاكتبنا so writes/decrees us مع with الشهدىن the witnesses 584-86 وما and what لنا for us لا not نومن we believe بالله in the god وما and what جانا came us من from الحق the truth ونطمع and we hope ان that ىدخلنا entered us ربنا lord ours مع with القوم the folk الصلحىن the righteous فاثبهم so rewards them الله the god بما in what قالوا said they of جنت gardens تجرى flow من from تحتها underneath it الانهر the rivers خلدىن eternally live فىها therein وذلك and such جزا recompense المحسنىن the good doers والذىن and the ones كفروا reject they of وكذبوا and deny they of باىتنا in signs ours اولىك those اصحب companions الجحىم the abyss https//corpuscoranicum.de/handschriften/index/sure/5/vers/83/handschrift/15 Berlin, Staatsbibliothek ms.or.fol. 4313 dating 606-652CE (95.4% see 7th line from bottom 1st word) https//i.postimg.cc/cxcNHwhm/ch5v76-87.jpg